851: How to Reclaim Your Confidence with Nicole Kalil

Pete Mockaitis

Nicole, welcome to How to be Awesome at Your Job.

Nicole Kalil

Thank you so much for having me, Pete. I am thrilled to be here.

Pete Mockaitis

Well, I’m thrilled to be chatting. And I want to understand what’s up with you and blue ink?

Nicole Kalil

That’s so funny. I don’t know why it makes me nauseous. Any time I have to write in blue ink, I get this sinking feeling. I don’t know if I was traumatized by a pen in my past, or what happened, but it just is not my thing. It must be black ink at all times.

Pete Mockaitis

So, that’s when if you write in blue ink, you get nauseous.

Nicole Kalil

Yes.

Pete Mockaitis

Now, if you read blue ink on a screen or that someone else has written it, is it fine?

Nicole Kalil

It’s fine. It doesn’t bother me. It’s just when it’s like coming out of the pen that’s in my hand.

Pete Mockaitis
Interesting.

Nicole Kalil
Yeah.

Pete Mockaitis
What if you’re, like, not looking at the paper while you write with the blue ink?

Nicole Kalil

You know, I haven’t tried it that hard to overcome this particular challenge or to test it out. I just know, I mean, I have drawers full of black pens, so it doesn’t happen that often. I haven’t tested out if I closed my eyes, or didn’t look, or if it’s a certain type of blue, or any of that stuff.

Pete Mockaitis

Yeah, fascinating. Well, sometimes I think some documents I think I’ve had to sign them in blue ink. Every once in a while, that comes up.

Nicole Kalil

Yes, it does come up. Typically, like when you go sign lawyers’ documents or things like that, and I just take a deep breath, and work my way through it, and keep my eyes on the prize. I do not like it.

Pete Mockaitis

Okay. Well, I’m glad we established that, and I will not ask you to write anything in blue ink. But I will ask you lots of questions about confidence, one of our favorite topics here. So, you have the title confidence sherpa. Is that accurate?

Nicole Kalil

Yes.

Pete Mockaitis

I love it.

Nicole Kalil

Thank you.

Pete Mockaitis

I could see you in a large coat as I visualize.

Nicole Kalil

Exactly, with the fur. It’s more interesting than founder or the more traditional titles. And I think it’s a little bit more telling, about what I’m passionate about and also how I see my work, climbing the mountain along with you, as opposed to somebody standing at the mountain top telling you what to do or how to do it.

Pete Mockaitis

Okay. Now, when it comes to confidence, I’d love to hear, is there any particularly fascinating, surprising, counterintuitive discovery you’ve made about confidence in your years of working in this space?

Nicole Kalil

Definitely, yes, but I’m going to start with probably the most surprising thing, is I think most of us don’t have enough confidence because we, literally, have no idea of what confidence is. It’s one of those words that’s been thrown around left and right, and leveraged, and utilized in so many different ways that I think it’s, somewhere along the line, lost its meaning.

So, I went back to the etymology, the root of the word confidence to try to really understand what is it that we’re talking about, what does this ever elusive confidence that we’re all trying to buy, produce, seek, create. And, ultimately, the most surprising thing to me about confidence is that it wasn’t what I thought it was.

I thought confidence was a little bit more associated with arrogance, or ego, or courage, or feeling good, or being attractive. Ultimately, confidence is firm and bold trust in self. The root of the word confidence is trust, faith, belief. Any translation to any language, if you look at it where confidence comes from, even if you look at the iterations of the word, like a confidante, it’s a close trusted friend, confidential, a confidence con, or a con artist. It’s all about, the root of it is all about trust.

So, at least for the purposes of my conversations when I talk about confidence, I’m talking about firm and bold trust in self.

Pete Mockaitis

Yeah, I think I could just sit and meditate upon that for a few minutes.

Nicole Kalil

It’s a big one.

Pete Mockaitis
Because that, in and of itself, is juicy, because some academic definitions is like, “Okay, tactically, you’ve distinguished that from other constructs. Great job, professor so-and-so.” But this is weighty.

Nicole Kalil

No, it’s big. It felt really big to me. And even today, I find myself using the word wrong or thinking something is going to bring me confidence that doesn’t because my whole life I’ve been socialized to believe at something else. And as a woman, I think there’s a little bit of a nuance that tells me that my confidence is wrapped up in how I look and how other people perceive me. And that flies completely in the face of this definition of firm and bold trust in self.

Pete Mockaitis

And as I chew on this definition, as I think about trust, it’s almost like, “Well, to what end?” I trust that I’m not going to burn down my office. I am 100% confident that will not happen today.

Nicole Kalil

At least not today.

Pete Mockaitis

I have a Jetboil, I tell my landlord, “I only use it outside.” So, tell us more about that. Trust in self to do what or just for everything?

Nicole Kalil

I would argue just about everything but I think sometimes trust and competence get confused. And, also, one of the other surprising things I learned about what builds confidence is failure builds confidence. Why? Because it’s easy to trust ourselves when things are going according to plan, when we’re winning, when we’re achieving, when we are checking all the boxes.

Trusting ourselves is easy during those moments. It’s when fear and doubt, or when you make mistakes, it’s the trust that’s required to pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off, get back into action. It’s the “I’m still okay. I trust that I’ll be okay on the other side of this, trust that I will learn, I’ll grow, I’ll come out better, that it served a purpose.”

I think choosing to trust ourselves during the harder times is where this skill, this muscle gets developed at a much deeper sustainable longer-lasting way. So, that was another surprising thing, is that failure actually builds confidence, if you choose it, if you let it, because, again, trust isn’t necessarily “I have all the answers. I know what I’m doing. I have it all figured out.” It’s trusting that “I’ll be okay no matter what, and that I can come out better on the other side.”

Pete Mockaitis

Okay. Well, can you tell us an inspiring story of a professional who was able to develop extraordinary confidence?

Nicole Kalil

What I would argue that we’re all doing it all the time, and I think any one of us who have taken big risks, chased any dreams, had difficult conversations, raised their hand for something they wanted, put one foot in front of the other towards what matters, is exercising and building confidence. And I don’t know that any human feels a hundred percent confident a hundred percent of the time. But I would just argue that the skill is required to both get what we want and, also, gets developed in the action that it takes to move toward what we want. It feeds off itself.

Pete Mockaitis

Okay. Well, could you maybe give us an example of that playing out?

Nicole Kalil

Yeah. So, I’ll use myself. I don’t know that I’m the most successful person or the best example but it’s the one I know inside and out. I was an executive at a Fortune 100 financial services company, very male-dominated industry. I was the first female in my role in the company’s 160-year history. And I was doing well from the outside looking in, looked the part of the independent successful woman on the rise with my “Who needs a man” attitude.

But the way that it was on the inside did not match at all the way that it looked on the outside. I was living for the validation of others. I was chasing the next promotion, the next achievement, and I had this false equation in my mind that if X happened, and fill in the blank of X with whatever you want. If I fit into a certain size, if I bought the right car, if I lived in the right house, if I got a certain level of income, whatever it was, when X happened, then I would feel confident.

That never worked. I would get the thing, or achieve, or accomplish, and I would feel temporarily satisfied until all the feelings of fear and doubt, and whether or not I could do the job, whether or not somebody saw me a certain way, came rushing back in, and I began to realize that my confidence was tied to everything and everyone outside of me. I had my confidence living out there.

And in doing the work that I talk about in my book, and really focusing on this true definition of confidence, and all the things that build confidence, all the things that were chipping away at it, in doing this work, I uncovered that the role that I was in, at the company that I was at, was, ultimately, not where I wanted to be anymore. There wasn’t anything wrong with it. I could’ve been retired there and been successful and all that, but I wasn’t living my true purpose. I wasn’t doing what I felt I was really put here to do.

And so, with a lot of courage and a lot of confidence, I stepped down from this very big, multiple six-figure role to start my own business, and that took a ton of confidence, and then building that business, and pivoting during COVID, and entering this year without any business goals for the first time in my professional life, and still doing more, chasing more, risking more. I think all of those, hopefully, are demonstrations of confidence in action.

And that’s not to say that I feel confident a hundred percent of the time. I’ve messed up. I made mistakes. I’ve learned. I’ve grown. I’ve been afraid. I have doubts. I have days where I’m not at my absolute best, and yet I still get to choose how to interpret those events. I get to choose to see them in a more productive, more empowered way, and come out better on the other side.

Pete Mockaitis

Beautiful. Okay. Well, let’s hear a bit about your book Validation Is For Parking: How Women Can Beat the Confidence Con. What is the confidence con?

Nicole Kalil

So, the confidence con is this idea that our confidence is built externally, it’s built through validation, or compliments, or achievements, or successes. By the way, I’m not saying that there’s anything wrong with any of those things. I’m just saying that those are not, in fact, what bring you confidence. Your confidence isn’t out there. No one or nothing is walking around with your confidence waiting for you to find it and get them to give it to you.

Your confidence is an inside job, it’s an internal thing and skill that you can develop and grow any time you want, which is contrary to the messages, I think, we receive very often out there. So, I call that false messaging the con, and the book is really focused on the things that actually build confidence, build trust.

Pete Mockaitis

Okay. Well, tell us, what are the things that actually build confidence and trust? How do we pull it off?

Nicole Kalil

Okay. So, there are five confidence builders that I identify in the book. I also identified five confidence derailers because there are things that are chipping away at doing damage to our confidence. If we’re not mindful of those things, we can do all of the building work we want, but we end up feeling like we’re on a hamster wheel. We’re doing a lot of work but not moving very much forward.

So, I’ll identify the five confidence builders quickly. Action. Action builds confidence. I can’t find a single expert or research or article on the topic of confidence that doesn’t agree with that. You don’t think or hope or fingers and toes crossed your way into confidence. You get into action towards it. So, action, failure, we talked about that a little bit already.

Giving yourself grace. The way you talk to yourself matters. So, this can be mindset work, this can be speaking to yourself the way you would, somebody else that you love, respect and admire. The fourth confidence builder is choosing confidence, which I know sounds a little obvious, but I think a lot of us think confidence is a feeling that we either have or we don’t, as opposed to a choice we can make anytime that we want.

And then, finally, the fifth confidence builder is building internal trust. It’s the things that we can do to establish, grow, develop, build trust in ourselves.

Pete Mockaitis

Okay. Lovely. So, those are the builders. And then what are the derailers?

Nicole Kalil

So, the five derailers, the first is perfectionism, this idea that we’re supposed to have it all, do it all, be it all, and look good while doing it. Perfectionism is the enemy of confidence because it’s not an achievable goal. Head trash is the second confidence derailer. This is the voice inside of our own minds that says things to us about us that are never kind, and very rarely based in fact or in truth. So, head trash, that internal negative voice.

The third confidence derailer is judgment and comparison, this thing that we do where we compare ourselves to other people, and we either fall short or think we’re better than. Confidence is not comparing yourself to somebody else and feeling superior. Confidence does not even mean compare yourself to anyone at all.

The fourth confidence derailer is overthinking. Thinking is not a problem. We should all be doing it. Overthinking is problematic because overthinking leads to inaction. Inaction creates regret. And then, finally, the fifth confidence derailer is seeking it externally. It’s hoping that the person of your dreams is going to give you confidence, or the weight loss, or the certain level of income, or certain amount of followers on social media. This idea that something external, something outside of us is going to infuse us with confidence.

Pete Mockaitis

Okay. So, that’s a nice lay of the land there in terms of the builders and the derailers. Can you share with us perhaps some of the best practices in terms of bang-for-the-buck, what are the practices we should take on that makes a world of difference in terms of having more confidence?

Nicole Kalil

Absolutely. So, I’m going to walk through an exercise. In my book, I think have ten different exercises that are all designed to help because I’m more of a tactical-oriented person. I don’t want somebody to just tell me to be confident. I want them to give me action steps, tactical steps, so there’s a lot of that in the book, but I’ll give one as an example.

And it’s the process that we can go through inside of our own minds of either overcoming or rethinking about failure. So, if you made a mistake, or you’ve experienced failure, or you’re worried about it, ask yourself, first and foremost, “What are the facts?” So, let’s say, and, Pete, this is actually true, “I feel like I’m having a little bit of an off day. I, hopefully, am not blowing it but I don’t know that this is the best podcast I’ve ever done in the history of ever.”

So, my brain is starting to go into head trash, and I’m screwing up, and, “Oh, my gosh, all these people are hearing me mess up. And what if…? This is a top podcast and Pete is awesome, and he thinks I’m an idiot,” so my brain is going crazy. So, here’s an exercise in action. First, I ask myself, “What are the facts?” The facts are it’s 24 minutes into a recording with Pete on the How to be Awesome at Your Job podcast.

The facts are it’s a top 1% podcast. The facts are I got invited to be on the show. The facts are that I’m speaking about confidence. What are the facts and only the facts? This is important because we often interact with our interpretations or our perspectives as if they’re facts. We don’t want to do that. So, step number one is, “What are the facts and only the facts?”

Step number two, “What am I making up about the facts? I’m making up that I’m having an off day. I’m making up that I forgot to mention this. I’m making up that I spent a little bit too much time explaining that. I’m making up that I’m the worst guest you ever had. I’m making up, I’m making up, I’m making up.”

And for a lot of us, what we’re making up is a negative, disempowered, unproductive version or interpretation of the facts. It doesn’t support us. It doesn’t help us in moving toward what we want, what matters, the risks we want to take, the dreams we want to chase. Okay, so that’s step number two, “What am I making up about the facts?”

Step number three, “Is there a different, more empowered, more productive way to see it? Is there a different interpretation of the facts other than the one I made up?” And a little pro tip here. While any of us can do this for ourselves, sometimes it’s helpful to engage a trusted friend, or a colleague, or a coach, or a mentor. It’s sometimes hard to see things clearly from the inside. There’s an expression that says, “You can’t read the label from the inside of the bottle.” And that’s what I think of here.

Sometimes that different, more productive, more empowered version of the facts can come to you from somebody outside, telling you how they see it. Now, it is still your responsibility because nobody gives you confidence to go from there, and you get to decide which interpretation you choose, or which one you believe, but another interpretation of the facts is, “What an honor it is for me to be here. Whether it was perfect or not, I took the risk, I was excited about the opportunity.”

“I am sure that there is at least one person listening who’s going to be impacted in some way. Somebody is going to be thinking about confidence in a new way, in a different way that maybe is more supportive. Somebody might take a risk on the other side of this. I’m going to learn. I’m going to get better as a guest.”

So, which of those two interpretations of the facts is more true, is more factual or more correct? The answer is neither. I’m making up both interpretations, but one of those is more productive, one of those is more empowered, one of those is going to support me in moving towards what matters, is going to support me in doing bigger and better things.

Which leads to step number four, which is, “What action do I take from here?” So, now with us more productive, more empowered, interpretation of the facts, “What action do I take from here?” Maybe the action is sharing this episode on social media in my platforms. Maybe this action is asking if there’s another podcast that I really want to be on that maybe you would make an introduction. Maybe the action is listening to this episode and really thinking about, “What are the learning opportunities? What could I do better? What skill can I develop from here?”

There are so many actions I can take, but action builds confidence, and so the problem with mistakes, or failures, or head trash, or all, is often, it puts us in a spin and we end up physically or mentally in the fetal position doing nothing. And so, this four-step process, hopefully, helps to get outside of our heads and towards what really matters.

Pete Mockaitis

Okay. Yeah, that’s cool. Thank you. I dig it. And then the facts and only the facts, and then what are you making up, and then what is a different interpretation. That’s cool. I’m curious, are there also some practices that are handy outside the heat of battle but just, as a general thing to do, maybe daily, weekly, quarterly, in terms of, “Huh, this is wise and will keep that confidence boosted over the course of the year”?

Nicole Kalil

Yeah, so the example I just gave and a few others, I would say, are more reactive or more, like, “Hey, I’m struggling. I need something to get me back on track.” I think there are some things that you can do that are more proactive, or even preventative, or that help you from getting into that place. So, there are a few things.

The first I’ll mention is something called “The things I know to be true about me at this point in my life.” I know that’s a ridiculously long title for an exercise but, ultimately, in order to trust yourself, I believe you need to know yourself. This is an exercise in self-awareness and self-appreciation. So, you spend some time thinking about, “What do I know to be true about me at this point in my life? What are my superpowers? What are my unique abilities? What makes me different? What comes more naturally? What do I count on about myself? What do other people count on about me? What might be my unique purpose?”

[24:19]

Any of those questions, you just start laundry-listing them out. I’ve done this exercise more with women than any other gender, but I’ve found that the average number of things people can come up with is six. Six things they know to be true about themselves, which is mind-blasting to me because with all of our life experience, with all of our complex things that make us us, it is just an indication of how little time we are spending building our own self-awareness, getting to know and appreciate, and respect, and admire ourselves.

Pete Mockaitis

And could you give some examples of some of these things?

Nicole Kalil

Yeah, absolutely. So, I’m a good decision-maker. I mean what I say, I say what I mean. I love my family. Full stop. No negotiations. I have a sarcastic personality. So, those are some examples. My list is much longer now but those are some examples of things that are on my list, things that I know and can count on about myself. These aren’t wish lists. This isn’t who I want to be. And nobody is anything one hundred percent of the time.

So, let’s take that I’m a good decision-maker. It doesn’t mean I’ve only ever made 100% good decisions. It just means that that is a skill that I rely on regularly, that other people have admired about me, that often gets leveraged or utilized in my work.

Pete Mockaitis

And so, these things, I’m just thinking, in terms of, like, the filter or the relevancy is, like, I could name dozens of things I know to be true about myself that are somewhat inconsequential, “I like drinking LaCroix.” Like, okay. And so, that’s true, I know that with confidence, Nicole, I could tell you that. I don’t know if that’s getting me anywhere though. Can you help me out with that?

Nicole Kalil

Yeah, sure. I would say, as an initial starting point, put anything that comes to mind with no judgment. This list is between you and you. You don’t have to necessarily go out and share it with anybody. I would, as a starting point, lock yourself in a room, or go outside with a beautiful view and fresh air, or wherever your mental juices get flowing, and just allow yourself to ask the question, “What do I know to be true about me at this point in my life?”

And if “I love LaCroix” ends up on the list, let’s leave it there for now. At least as a starting point, try not to judge, try not to kneecap, try not to find evidence for what comes out. So, I’ll give another example. I’ve had people say “I’m honest to a fault.” Just cross out the “to a fault.” Just “I’m honest.” If somebody takes fault with that, that might be a ‘them’ problem, not a ‘you’ problem. But we have a tendency to say something about ourselves and then kneecap that sentence, or soften, or add disclaimers, “I’m pretty smart.” It’s okay to just be smart. Cross out the pretty.

So, Pete, I don’t know if that answered your question but I would start with putting everything on. And then, at some point in time, you’re going to edit the list and refine it to maybe what matters most. But back to your earlier question, this is something you can read at the start of each day. This is a more personal, more customized mantra, or something that you can tape on your mirror, or something that you read right before you’re about to do something big or take a big risk, so you’re really grounded in who you are and what makes you unique, what makes you special, what are the unique abilities you’re bringing to the table.

And my hope is that it encourages you to trust yourself because you’re grounded in what you can count on, but it also encourages the risks, it’s also a good thing to go, “Oh, I want that. What do I know about me supports me doing that?” So, for example, I launched my own podcast. That was really scary for me, but my ‘things I know to be true’ list encouraged me, it aligned with this thing that I wanted to do, so it made it clear for me that I knew I was going to be able to make it happen.

Pete Mockaitis

That’s just really cool, Nicole. And I’m reminded of a conversation I had with Hal Elrod with The Miracle Morning, talking about six morning habits, about affirmations. And so, he really emphasized making truthful affirmations as opposed to “I am a money magnet, and money flows to me effortlessly.” You’re like, “No, no, it didn’t. I really had to hustle to get that money.”

And so, if you start not so much from a “How could I affirm myself?” but rather “Oh, what do I know to be true?” I’m imagining, as you edit that, you get to a pretty powerful rundown that, as you look at and you say, it’s sort of like an affirmation, but the way we got there was starting with foundations that are true about you as opposed to, like, wishes and desires.

Nicole Kalil

Yeah, I find it harder to trust a wish or a desire. I don’t have much evidence. And, of course, trust implies a little bit of not having all of the evidence. But I want to ground myself in what I trust, what I feel confident about, what I know to be true first. And, I don’t know, I think affirmations and mantras have a wonderful place. The more aspirational ones, or the ones that, as you mentioned, just hasn’t resonated with me personally. I am not suggesting that people shouldn’t do it or that it doesn’t work. I’m just saying it didn’t work for me. So, this is my sort of tweak on it.

Pete Mockaitis

That’s cool. Okay. Well, tell me, Nicole, any other favorite practices that really pack a wallop?

Nicole Kalil

I start with a list of ten things that build internal trust, and it’s not, by any means, limited to ten, and I won’t go through ten today, but when we think about confidence as firm and bold trust in self, and we understand that it’s not going to come to us from the outside, and it’s built from the inside-out, then it begs the question, “How do I do that? How do I build trust with myself?”

And so, first, I would encourage you to think about how you build trust with others, and how others build trust with you. That will give you some insight into what’s most important to you. But there are a few things that I think are fairly universal. For example, keep your commitments. We trust people more who do what they say they’re going to do. We trust people more who follow through on their commitment. We tend to trust people who flake or don’t show up when they’re going to less. This is not a hundred percent true across the board but I’d say pretty general.

So, if you think about that, then, “How do I build trust with myself?” You take those things and you take it internal. Well, first and foremost, keeping the commitments you make to yourself, at least as much as, if not more, than the commitments you make to others. I think so many of us follow through on the commitments to our colleagues, to our bosses, to our children, at a much greater level than the commitments we make to ourselves. And, unfortunately, that’s doing damage and chipping away at our own trust.

We also have the tendency to overcommit, and that can be problematic as it relates to building trust. Now, again, perfectionism is the enemy of confidence, so this isn’t about keeping 100% of your commitments 100% of the time, but it is about doing it more often than not. That’s how we build and grow trust within ourselves.

Some other examples. Standing up for yourself builds self-trust. Speaking your truth. Saying what you mean, meaning what you say. Communicating boundaries can be a big trust builder. Being your own hype person. There are so many examples but it’s really thinking about, “What matters most to me as it relates to trust?” and then turning it inward and thinking about, “How do I do this with and for myself, for my own confidence?”

Pete Mockaitis

Well, now I’m intrigued, Nicole, about any number of situations. We had on the show Carol Kauffman who had a great question, “Who do I want to be now?” in terms of different circumstances, and there’s repeat thoughts connecting. It’s funny. I’m thinking right now, if someone provides you with service that is not quite acceptable, usually, I’m like, “You know, I don’t want to make a big issue of it. It’s not that big a deal. I don’t want to hurt their feelings.”

I got a little bit of people-pleaser in me, “I don’t want to hurt their feelings or put them on the spot. And, really, I’m so blessed in so many ways. Am I really going to make an issue over this carpet isn’t cut quite right or they forgot something with my restaurant order.” And so, usually, I kind of say nothing. But what you described makes me think, “Huh, there may be a whole lot of value in kindly, lovingly, diplomatically, saying, oh, speaking up for myself in those environments.” What are your thoughts here?

Nicole Kalil

I’m right there with you. I’m also a recovering people-pleaser, and I have to check in with myself. If I don’t say anything, how will I feel on the other side of this? Will I feel frustrated? Will I feel disappointed? Will I feel like I let myself or someone else down? Will I be pissed off? And if the answer to any of those questions is yes, then I probably should say something.

But, Pete, you hit the nail on the head. How I say it is a big differentiator and how I feel about myself. So, like you said, maybe it’s not that big of a deal, maybe it’s just, I had this recently with a contractor, “Hey, you’ve done phenomenal work. I could not be more pleased. I would recommend you to people. But can I give you one piece of feedback, one thing that I didn’t particularly enjoy in my relationship, and that would prevent me from referring you in certain situations or to certain types of people? Are you open? Would that feedback be valuable?”

So, I got to speak from what was true for me. I got to share something that was on my mind, and that was really bothering me. But I got to do it in a productive way for both of us and, by the way, I also have had the moments where I’ve gotten so pissed off that I over-rotated and the guys standing up for myself just ended up being a big jerk.

And I had to check in with myself on that I think the judgments and the things that we say, always tell us more about us than the other person. And the only thing I have any control over anyway is how I show up.

Pete Mockaitis

And what’s interesting as I imagine this conversation with contractor, whomever, felt like the worst-case scenario play out like wildly unrealistic, they start screaming at you, like, “Well, Nicole, it is absolutely outrageous that you would expect such a thing given the timeline and the budget, and it’s, frankly, extremely rude of you to throw this minor foible in our faces when we’ve bent over backwards to over deliver and be awesome for you.” Okay, so that’s, like, over-the-top negative reaction to a piece of feedback.

And that, in and of itself, could be a confidence builder in terms of, “Hey, you know what, I just survived the worst-case scenario, and it didn’t damage me,” assuming, hopefully, that you’re not going to then prosecute yourself, like, “Oh, I shouldn’t have said that. That was so bad of me.” Hopefully, you’re not at risk for going down that pathway. But, yeah, tell us about that.

Nicole Kalil

You hit the nail on the head. First of all, the worst case very rarely happens. We always make up the worst case in our minds, and it’s almost never that. And the other thing that you said that’s so important, it’s a confidence builder either way. I get to be proud of myself that I spoke my truth. I am not responsible for how they respond, or how they react, or what they choose to do with it.

He was lovely. He was like, “I so appreciate the feedback.” He could’ve walked out of here, and was like, “She’s full of crap. I’m not taking any of that.” I don’t know. All I know is I was willing to get uncomfortable to share something that was important for me to share. I trusted that my voice mattered. I trusted that my opinion mattered. And I trusted that this feeling that was existing within me was worth putting words on.

Pete Mockaitis

That’s cool. Well, Nicole, tell me, any other key things you want to make sure to mention before we hear about some of your favorite things?

Nicole Kalil

There’s an expression that we hear a lot in professional environments, the “Fake it till you make it.” This is going to sound like semantics because it’s just a different word choice, but I prefer “Choose it until you become it.” Faking it sends the message of inauthenticity, and I think when we separate from our authentic selves, we create tears in our trust.

When we try to show up as someone or something that we’re not or be another person, fake it, I think we actually inadvertently do some damage to our trust and to our confidence. And so, my spin on it is “Choose it until you become it.” Choose to trust yourself moment by moment, day by day, until the feeling catches up. Choose confidence until you become it.

Pete Mockaitis

All right. Well, now, Nicole, could you share with us a favorite quote, something you find inspiring?

Nicole Kalil

Yes, so I have this in my office that says, “You’ll be too much for some people. Those aren’t your people.”

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. And a favorite study or experiment or bit of research?

Nicole Kalil

So, I am not an avid researcher. I rely on other researchers to find the information. So, Adam Grant, I’m just a huge fan and I follow all of his stuff, and his book Think Again was really impactful for me.

Pete Mockaitis

I was about to ask for a favorite book. Is that it or is there another?

Nicole Kalil

I could use that but I read 80% of the time for pleasure, and maybe 20% of the time for self-development or work-related things. So, on the personal side, Louise Penny mystery books are favorites.

Pete Mockaitis

All right. And a favorite tool, something you use to be awesome at your job?

Nicole Kalil

Airtable, the app. I would literally would be lost without it, so that’s my go-to.

Pete Mockaitis

Nicole, you are an entry in one of our Airtable’s guest CRM.

Nicole Kalil

Oh, I love that.

Pete Mockaitis

It’s just magic.

Nicole Kalil

You are on mine. That’s how I prepped.

Pete Mockaitis

And a favorite habit?

Nicole Kalil

I’m an avid reader, that’s probably my favorite thing I do. I read 50 or more books every single year, but what is a unique take on it is I read during my working hours because I consider it professional and personal development. It helps me be better at my job.

Pete Mockaitis

Okay. And is there a key nugget you share that really seems to connect and resonate with folks; they quote it back to you often?

Nicole Kalil

So, the “Don’t fake it till you make it. Choose it until you become it.” But also, the expression “You can’t learn to park in a parked car.” Just a reminder that action is how we learn and grow and do just about anything.

Pete Mockaitis

And if folks want to learn more or get in touch, where would you point them?

Nicole Kalil

My website is probably the best place, NicoleKalil.com. It has all the things.

Pete Mockaitis

Okay. And do you have a final challenge or call to action for folks looking to be awesome at their jobs?

Nicole Kalil

My call to action is to trust yourself, to choose confidence on the road to competence. The reality is you can’t be competent at anything when you’re trying it for the first time, or when you’re doing something new, or when you’re taking on a new challenge. Competence is something that’s gained and earned over time. And so, since you can’t be competent day one, the option is to use confidence because you can do that any time you want. So, confidence on the road to competence.

Pete Mockaitis

All right. Nicole, thank you. This has been a treat. I wish you much fun and confidence.

Nicole Kalil

Thanks, Pete. I appreciate it. Thanks for having me.