1182: Connecting More Powerfully in an AI-Driven World with Gina London

Pete Mockaitis
Gina, welcome!

Gina London
Hi, it’s great to see you. Thanks so much.

Pete Mockaitis
Well, I’m excited to talk about getting amplified, and congrats on the fresh release of your book, Amplify You: How to Power Up Your Connections in an AI World. Could you start by sharing with us one of the most surprising discoveries you made while putting this together?

Gina London
Well, when I started this whole journey, because I work as a communications coach and trainer and speaker, I think the thing that continually stopped me when I first moved in from being a broadcaster and a television journalist into strategy communications and transferring the skills is that it is a transferable skill. Because I thought, “Well, this is something everybody does. And what can I bring to this?”

And one of my friends who actually worked for the BBC when I was at CNN, she said, “Gina, you forget what the rigors of 24-hour news have done for you in terms of your story-crafting and your vocal presence and the energy that you bring on camera is something anybody can learn for themselves, but most of them don’t, unless they have.” Like, you’re going to a gym, you’re not going to just watch a YouTube video and then pick up the trap bar and do it properly. You need a coach to help you.

And so as I was writing this, I thought, “I want to give fundamental but essential skills in a way that’s easy to apply and habit-stack one on top of each other in an incremental, developable way. So I can give people this guide book that they can use to help them power up their connections and their humanness, especially when we got all this AI stuff making us feel somehow very replaceable.

I want to help people to say, “No, these are the tools that anybody can develop.” But it does take some effort and it is a skill. So I’m surprised that we’ve got it all out here, but it goes from the way you talk to yourself, the way you talk to others, the way you show up, and then put it all together in some behavioral techniques. And I’m pretty proud of how comprehensive it is. So I’m really delighted that it’s out in the world now.

Pete Mockaitis
Beautiful, yes. Well, congratulations.

Gina London
Thank you.

Pete Mockaitis
Could you share with us a cool story of someone who, indeed, amplified themselves, they started from a spot where they figured, “I needed some help,” and then what they did and what the result was?

Gina London
Yeah, I’m so grateful because I did start writing this column. I write in the Sunday Independent newspaper here in Ireland, and it’s on leadership and communications. And so I got a note from someone who had read the column.

He was the CEO of a big engineering company here in Ireland, but he was also, he’d acquired a new company in the UK and he was also requiring something in North America. And as these acquisitions were going through, he was going to be doing a roadshow to meet with the employees.

And he said, “Gina, I’m very aware that I’m a big guy, I’m a serious guy.” And as I was watching him when we were having our initial discovery call, I said, “Yeah, and you’re an intimidating guy. And if you’re coming into my new company, and I’m an employee, I’m going to be questioning, ‘Am I going to be made redundant? Does this guy really care about me? What is happening to my job?’”

And so I put him on camera, doing this, “Welcome, and here’s the vision,” discussion that he would do normally. And then we played it back and I said, “Now I want you to do it again and I want you to smile like your face is feeling like it’s going to crack.”

And the big guy, Steven, says, “Well, I don’t do this happy-clappy stuff.” I’m like, “Just work with me a little bit on this.” And we played that second clip back and he watched it and he said, “You know what? I could smile even more.”

And that’s where that light bulb moment is where someone sees how others see them and they realize it’s not fake, it’s not manipulative, but it is an effort. And if you’re unaware of what you look like when you’re communicating, well, that’s the first step to building your awareness.

And then the second step is let’s have a desire to amplify, not change you, but let’s start taking more control of these things. So it’s not just about smile more, but it’s about, “Are you aware of the emotions of what you’re saying? Have you chosen words that are connecting with your specific audience? Do you have more control over the vocality to support those words? Is it energetic? Is it confidential? Is it thoughtful?”

And then, “Do you have the face and the body and the gestures and all of that integrated so you’re creating a real compelling, connecting,” and in this case with my guy Steven, “reassuring communication experience?”

So it’s reminding people that communication is not just a transfer of information, it’s creating an experience with the big giant caveat that this is not manipulation and then fake and exploitation when you have mutually beneficial goals in mind, and that it’s heartfelt and driven by your values. So we get into that as well.

Pete Mockaitis
Oh, Gina, I like that so much. There’s so much goodness there. And so I like the way you said it with regard to amplify, you know, you’re not some other creature. You are you, amplified because you’re not aware of how you come across. And that is just eye-opening for people all the time when they see themselves on video.

I’ve taken a video of friends that said, “Hey, watch out, you keep doing this thing where you’re stroking your tie.” He’s like, “What? No, I’m not.” It’s like, “Oh, wow, that’s so weird.” You’re shocked. Like, you can’t believe it until you behold it. And he was like, “Oh, well, there it is. Okay. That’s a thing that’s happening. Wow!”

Gina London
Exactly, because we have these patterns and habits of how we’ve been communicating up until now. Most of us are on default. And so we don’t know. Maybe we might have been told, “Hey, you ramble,” or, “Hey, I don’t know what you’re saying,” or, “Hey, I can’t actually understand you because you mumble.”

But then most of us stop right there and think, “Well, that’s just how I am. That’s just the authentic me.” And I want everyone to understand that your self-acceptance and your self-development do not have to be at friction, that you can still be who you are and you’re a great human being and you’ve come as far as you have you’ve come.

And you can also layer on some more intentionality of how you think about the other person, how you prepare for presentations or even just a one-on-one or a casual conversation.

This stuff matters, and I think it really matters more than ever because we are becoming more and more dependent upon Claude and Gemini and ChatGPT to help us in our written words. But if we don’t sound like we write, or we don’t write like we sound, that means we probably haven’t taken enough control of who we are.

And I think it’s really important for us now to be irreplaceable as humans. So human-up your skills, folks. And this book, I think, comes at a really great time.

Pete Mockaitis
Human-up your skills, yes, indeed. When you mentioned amplifying your facial expressions, your body language, your gestures, your vocal tone, and thinking about the emotions associated with what you’re saying, that is the telltale sign for me with regard to, I’m thinking about YouTube.

And if you’re watching something, maybe there’s no face and it’s just visuals, or maybe there is a person. But, like, that’s how I tell that it’s AI and, apparently, I don’t know, maybe the comments are fake, too, but it seems like it appears that many of these people, the comments, are completely unaware that this is not a human being in front of them.

But that is what does it for me, it’s like, “No, that person is saying something sad but they don’t look sad. Their tone of voice isn’t sad. Like, that person is saying something really surprisingly, powerfully insightful, but they don’t look like they’re saying it. It’s just wrong.” And so that’s what does it for me.

And what’s funny is a lot of humans are doing this, too, just before the land of AI. It’s like, “Wait, you’re saying something that’s, like, really a big deal but you don’t look like you think it’s a big deal? So now, I don’t know, is it a big deal or not? Or did I misunderstand you? What’s going on?”

There’s, like, a confusion inside of me when there is an incongruity when things don’t match up, assuming I’m paying enough attention. That’s another thing. It’s, like, maybe because it’s incongruous, it’s boring, and I don’t care, or I was like, “Well, whatever.” And so I’m not even paying enough attention to notice that it doesn’t match up.

Gina London
You are so hitting on the incongruity and the lack of attention span that people have these days. So in the incongruity piece, I have an illustration in the book of a three-legged stool: words, voice, and your body.

And in the body part, I would also include your clothing and your wardrobe choices and your grooming and those sorts of things because it’s all giving that impression of who you are to that audience.

But what we’re talking about is a lot of people, especially in business, more formal settings, like my CEO guy, they’re focusing on the words, but they haven’t learned how to integrate and connect the voice to the emotion behind those words. They haven’t necessarily picked words that are warm or that can be reassuring or connecting in the particular situation to that audience as well.

And then the body language piece, as I was mentioning, if it doesn’t look energetic or urgent or sensitive, there is that lack of balance, and that three-legged stool doesn’t stand as well if one leg is the only one that’s really engaged.

And with your point about the attention span, it’s not that everybody has to be super dramatic, it has to be jazz hands or whatever, but you do have to have that sense of, “I’m in real time with human beings. I’m seeing you. I’m hearing you.”

And this is the experience that is going to make them wake up for six seconds and not go back on their phone or get out of their thoughts and listen to you because you know the sense of urgency, you know the enthusiasm, you know the passion, and you have worked at yourself to be able to bring it so you’re not some slick, impersonal, overly polished and artificial AI slop. We got to ratchet this stuff up.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. Well said. I dig that a lot. Now, when we talk about these emotions, and I think that’s great in terms of them being a focal point to tie this together in terms of the theme, you know, the dress and the appearance and the intonations and the body gestures.

The emotion is the theme. Like, “Is this serious? Is this sad? Is this exciting? Is this inspiring?” I think some people might say, “You know, Gina, we’re just talking about facts. It’s like, ‘Hey, here’s the report of what happened over the last month. Here are the numbers. Here are some charts with the numbers. They’re just facts. So where do the emotions come into the play here, Gina?”

Gina London
Yeah, exactly. And this goes from one of my very first times I was ever going through TV anchor training, and they do have that. I went into some little studio in Texas with this coach and we were reading from a teleprompter, or I was reading.

And he was reminding me, and this was really important, and I use it with my clients all the time, too. It doesn’t matter what it is you’re delivering. Those numbers mean something not just for the shareholders, but maybe for your job or your bonus or the path of this company.

What are the hopes, dreams, and fears attached to those words? And because I am a positive communication coach, I’m not about being someone who preys on fears, but someone who reassures around fears. But be aware that there’s emotions to those words.

And so that doesn’t make you be overly theatrical or giving fake energy, but it does help you ground yourself. And what is experiencing, what the people who are hearing those seemingly just factual numbers experiencing?

I work with senior leaders who are giving their quarterly reports to the board, or their earnings reports to their shareholders, or they’re doing a town hall to their employees. People want to feel a connection. They want to know that they’re aligned on something that they can work toward that’s going to feed their family.

And I don’t care what topic it is. If it’s worth speaking about, it’s worth speaking about from the heart. And it’s not, by the way, I know we’re speaking in the US here, or I’m coming from Ireland and you’re in the US, but it’s not, “I am American.” It’s not an Americanist thing. It’s a human thing, because no matter where I go, people are wanting to be seen, to be heard, to be valued.

And if you’re the person who’s presenting whatever it is, you have that opportunity to either make more of a connection or be neutral. And there really is no neutral. Neutral is usually read as distracted, not interested, not caring, phoning it in, and none of that is going to build a connection or build trust.

Pete Mockaitis
Yeah, I like what you had to say with regard to the fear and reassuring. And we had another anchor on the show, Erica Mandy of The NewsWorthy, who was delightful. And whenever I’m listening to her short audio news program, which I think is swell, she does do that reassuring thing, and it feels good.

Like, if there’s bad news, she’ll own it and convey some emotions, like, “We do have another school shooting to tell you about, you know, last night….” She’ll sort of lay it out there, and like, “Yeah, this is sad. It’s concerning.” And it feels like she’s there with you as opposed to just saying the words.

Like, ‘Here is a thing that transpired.” It’s like, “Well, no, it’s actually heartbreaking and very troubling that this has happened yet again.” And so we’re feeling some of that emotion, but also in a reassuring way, like, “Oh, and our news anchor is freaked out, too.”

Gina London
Right, you’ve got to be able to know the goal and assume the role within the right parameters. If you’re in an anchor position, you can’t fall apart. You shouldn’t probably fall apart and start crying on air.

That said, if you were just dispassionate and just reading the words on the teleprompter, then the people listening or watching you are, “Do they have any emotional investment to it at all? No, they should because they’re human.”

Likewise, in the corporate world, if your sales numbers are down, somebody is upset about that. And if you’re too mean or not caring enough, you’re probably demotivating your employees.

And so it’s really important for people to know that you can set the energy, you set the weather with the tone of your voice, with the eye size that you give as you’re speaking. I had an accounting conference that I was the facilitator of a couple of years ago, “Ooh, accounting. So talk about numbers.”

But there’s still amazing people who are doing those numbers. And the president, as I was spotlighting the different speakers and facilitating the panel and the thing, at the very end, he came on stage and he had prepared remarks, and he said, “I’m going to take a page from Gina, and put my pages down.”

And he actually put them over on the podium and he walked to the front of the stage. And so he spoke from the heart. And I’m telling you, every single person, and that was nothing he’d ever done before, right? And every single person in that conference stood up and gave him outstanding ovation because it was such, for him, it was a big leap.

Now, for somebody who’s more practiced or they’re maybe more of an extrovert, this wouldn’t seem like a lot. And that’s what I think is so important about my book is that it takes anybody where they are, and these little things that might seem like not a big deal can bridge a gap between yourself and an audience in a positive way, which is what this is all about.

Pete Mockaitis
I’d love to hear what you have to say about confidence. Listeners always want more of it. They ask about it. They re-watch episodes about confidence. So how do we have more of it, Gina?

Gina London
Confidence is the outcome after you learn and can apply the techniques of best practices of communication. You don’t first think into confidence and then exude it. You realize vocal projection shows authority, “I will learn how to give more volume.”

Anybody, whether or not you’re a self-described introvert, extrovert, anywhere on that scale, you can learn to project your voice. Don’t rely on a microphone, number one. Number two, posture. Walking into a room with a slow but meaningful pace is going to affect a look of, “I belong. I’m comfortable. Looking out at the people in a room, I can make eye contact.”

Those little tools, when you know that you can do it and you’re practicing it and you’re actually doing it, that’s going to change your feedback loop of how people receive you. So the first position is you’re going to learn some of these techniques.

You might feel like you’re doing the big smiley crack thing like Stephen was when he was doing his presentation practice. But when you start to see how people react to you, it’s going to reassure you and reaffirm that.

So that changes that feedback loop of how you speak, how you walk, how you look, how you engage. That’s going to result in more head space for real-time decision-making around the content that you’re wanting to share or the conversation that you’re going to have.

And that makes you feel more confident as a result. So it’s an outcome. The actions inform the emotion, not the other way around.

Pete Mockaitis
Okie-dokie. So I’m not so much hearing it’s so much a matter of mindset or belief or self-talk. Is that in the mix at all for confidence?

Gina London
Yes, of course. So my book has three main sections: say it, look it, be it. And the say it part starts with how we talk about ourselves to ourselves. So, absolutely, I mean, the first person that you talk to in the morning and the last person that you talk to at night, even if you have a partner or you’re doing a little prayer, it’s still you.

And I think that’s really important is to… we have a section, I have a section, “How do you interrogate the words that you use to talk about yourself with yourself? Are they words that you own and that you truly believe, or were they maybe words that were put there by someone else?”

And if that was someone else that put it in there like a coach who said, “You don’t work hard enough,” or, in my case, a teacher who said I mumbled, are those things that are serving you? Are those things that you want to hold on to? Or, they’ve taken root because they were planted in by someone else?

So we go through that whole interrogation process because I do want you to have positive self-talk. I do absolutely encourage you to embrace the growth mindset that you can develop and amplify yourself. And that is okay.

The same way you develop a better tennis serve or a golf swing or a piano or violin, it’s the same application for how you become a more intentional communicator, an intentional human being.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. Now, in your pitch, I understand there are some communication habits that quietly undermine credibility and executive presence. Uh-oh, Gina, what are these and how do we stop them?

Gina London
Well, I’ve already touched on one, and that is the soft speaker. It’s not that if you’re an introvert, you have to be yelling all the time. But it is that a stronger voice, it’s going to be able to contribute in a busy meeting more than a soft voice that people over-speak.

So I certainly do want everyone to feel more comfortable hearing their voice hit the back of the room. It’s not about diaphragm breathing or anything super technical, but it is about matching the breadth of your voice along with that word is going up the top of your mouth, roof of your mouth, back to the back of that room.

And that’s going to help you when you say things like, “I have something I’d like to add here,” as opposed to inside, eating those words, “I have something I’d like to add here.” So that undermines your authority.

Your ability to reach out and try to network within an organization is also something that’s really important. Don’t think that your work is going to be the thing that’s getting you the attention or the promotion. You also need to work visibly, and that includes reaching out to people that might be two layers above you.

Not to say, “Hey, pick me, pick me,” but, “I see you,” or, “I’ve read about you,” or, “I saw you on this Slack meeting or something, and I’d like to know more about you. Could I have a 10-minute virtual or real coffee with you to learn your story because I find you inspiring, I find what you do interesting?”

People really gravitate to being asked for advice or sharing their story. So networking is a corporate-y word for just building relationships, but proactively building friendships and learning how to take more control of your voice would be the two things that I would encourage anybody to start being real intentional about.

Pete Mockaitis
I’m really digging your perspective on the emotional theming of things. And so in my mind’s eye, I’m seeing the How We Feel app, which divides the universe of emotions into pleasant and unpleasant, and high energy and low energy, and then within each of those 36, so a total of 144 possible emotional flavors there.

How do you think about the palatte or the landscape of emotion? Do you keep it broad in terms of, “Hey, these are kind of like one of the five-ish kind of core things on the menu”? Or do you get precise, like, “This is wistful versus bittersweet”?

Gina London
Well, that’s a fantastic question. And I want to also go back and say I’m digging your use of the word diggin’, by the way. That was really fun. And that’s where I think everybody has a palette.

So I would certainly not be someone that would say, “Let’s go through and I want you all to be able to see the same palette of colors the way that I want you to see the way I see them.”

I would encourage you to think more broadly because, when we get into wistful and we get into the, I mean, I think that’s a lovely nuance and I love poetry and I love literature, so I would certainly like that.

But to make it easier when someone is trying to power-up or human-up themselves from maybe never considering it, I don’t want to get into lavender versus violet because I think someone might have a hard time with, “Is it blissful? Is it wistful?” But I do want you to think about the hopes, dreams, and fears. So I break it into three.

And I do also use the visualization of when you’re speaking even a straightforward presentation, there are probably sections within that presentation that are more serious, more uplifting, something to be aspirational about.

And so I encourage people to look at their script or their presentation or their report, like a conductor would for an orchestra. Where are the parts of that presentation that you need to have your voice get a little slower to show some seriousness, where maybe you want to power it up because you’re telling an energetic story of victory or maybe one that’s more disappointing?

When you feel yourself in the emotions of the words, a lot of us can naturally change those, but some people can’t. So I don’t think you need to get into the subtlest, more microscopic, precise nuances of how you would describe the emotion, but I would like you to have the general understanding of where you are taking that audience at a particular time.

And if you are delivering some difficult news, I also would encourage you, “Can you give them a little bit of hope towards the end?” because we don’t want to just be left with our emotions flat on the floor. We want to be feeling like there’s some reason to keep going for some reason.

And if you’re a leader, or even if you’re a colleague presenting to other colleagues, I think keeping that in mind is also going to help you have the words in a particular order and have your voice and your body language and your facial expressions connecting to those emotions while you go on. So you are creating a journey.

Does it have to be extremely nuanced? No, but you should be aware of what you’re doing while you’re doing it. You should also be reading the room, because if you are delivering information, information, information, boring, boring, boring, and the eyes are starting to glaze over and you continue to steamroll through that, you have already lost them. If you think it’s boring for you, it’s completely boring for them.

Pete Mockaitis
Yeah, well said. The symphony orchestra conductor picture, I think, is super handy because, if you think of a great conductor, they really do, with their whole bodies, convey not just the tempo, like, you know, one, two, three, four. But, like, the mood, the vibes, the feels of the piece, and they’re quite distinct in terms of, like, the slow, sad part versus the fast, exciting part, all those dimensions with the pacing and the volume.

And I think, when you imagine yourself in such a role, it also feels rather empowering in terms of, “This is the art that I seek to create and the emotional journey movements of this piece of oratory,” not to get too highfalutin about it, but it does. It puts you in a good head space, I think, to really consider more dimensions than words, words, words.

Gina London
Than just the information, yeah, because you know, like any of us right now can think about, “Who was that boss that we really liked to listen to? Who was that teacher, that professor that really made the lecture come alive? Who is that person that you can think of right now that you think is a captivating speaker, if it’s a celebrity or a politician or whoever?”

More than likely, they have worked on this stuff. They think about, “Where is a place where I can put some energy in what might be a straightforward, otherwise, presentation or a report or an update?”

I was working in Switzerland last month with a chief medical officer of a big medical device company and very facts, very scientific, all of this, but I said, “You’re saving people with cancer. Is there a story that you can tell?” And I said, “Just give me someone’s first name.”

He got into this whole story about Christopher and what they were able to do and how it made him feel and what his family did. And this is from a very scientific sort of logos-minded, not ethos-minded guy. And it was captivating.

I said, “Now you can pick that little story as an example in an earnings update, in a town hall. You can do that stuff.” And what I’m driving at here is freeing people up to bring more of them, their human selves, into what might be an, otherwise, very dry, factual operations report.

It changes the way people receive you. And people do have shorter attention spans. They do want to connect with people in a work environment, wherever. These types of human skills, you can use them in so many different places. And I think it’s just really important for people to get excited about this and not feel like, “Oh, another set of rules.”

No, it’s you crafting oars for your little boat that’s already out there floating in the river of life, folks. What can you do? You can construct oars or paddles or maybe even a motor and a sail, and you can take more control of how it goes and how people interact with you. And I do find that really exciting.

It’s not just for, “Oh, she’s a natural,” or, “He’s a natural.” It’s a developable skill. And there are tools that you can put into your toolbox. And then depending on where you’re going, what the communication event is, and everything is a communication event, everything is worth trying these things out, changing those feedback loops, and then you’ll become more confident and more comfortable as a result.

And that’s really the keys that anybody can take. But they do have to take them, they do have to explore them and make them applicable for themselves.

Pete Mockaitis
Yeah, I like that a lot, and this is sort of the theme that’s coming up with regard to you keep your professionalism, well, in certain contexts. You keep professionalism and the emotions and it’s winning.

What comes to mind is so random, but it was a snippet from an earnings call. It was Strauss Zelnick of Take-Two Interactive. And he said something to the effect of, “Things are shaping up to be a blockbuster year fueled by the release of Grand Theft Auto VI, arguably the most anticipated entertainment release in history.”

And I thought, “Dang!” because, here he is, and earnings calls tend to be among the most boring and staid of contexts. And yet, I thought he did a fine job of saying something that’s pretty exciting, “Biggest entertainment release in history. Whoa!” within the same context that fits of, you know, professionalism, earnings call.

And if it was purely, like, reading a transcript, that would feel very weird, “The most anticipated entertainment release in history.” Like, it doesn’t sound like you’re anticipating it that much, bro.

Gina London
Exactly. If you’re going to use words that are superlative in nature, then why not link that with an energy in your voice? And if you are on video or people can see you and face to face, make that face match that, too. So back to the whole incongruence thing, it’s not off balance like that little three-legged stool.

And that’s where I encourage people to power up your language. If you have corporate lexicon that you have fallen into that trap of way of speaking, look at those words again. Does it mean anything to you? Does it say anything to a brand-new employee that’s just coming out of college who doesn’t know your corporate lingo?

If not, then change it, warm it up, make it have meaning. Don’t think that everybody knows what you’re saying because you’ve been saying it a certain way for so long. And if you are saying it with a complete lack of emotion or a complete lack of vocal intensity or energy, you are replaceable.

I’m sorry to say that that transcript can be written by ChatGPT or Claude now, sent out there, and probably read by some voice gen that’s going to sound really slick and have no soul. So if you have a soul, this is a chance to really make it shine and connect to the other souls in the room.

Pete Mockaitis
“If you have a soul, now’s your chance to make it shine.” I like that a lot. And with the professionalism, I think some people maybe have a little bit of fear of, like, cutting loose or getting too emotional. Like, it’s not Tom Cruise on Oprah’s couch, you know, in terms of like, “I’m so excited about this release.” It’s not that, but there’s genuine human emotion present within that professional package, and that’s winning.

Gina London
Exactly. And that’s one of the things that one of my first sections is all about the FAQs, “Well, Gina, what if I’m an introvert?” “Well, Gina, doesn’t this sound like it’s fake or exploitative?” And I answer all these questions.

And one of those things is, “Well, but I can’t just be overly animated, and, well, you’re telling me to do all these things all the time.” Like, “No, I’m telling you to be situationally aware. Don’t jump up, up and down on Oprah’s couch, unless you’re Tom Cruise, because you can, I suppose, do that if you want. But know the guardrails of your situation. But do push the boundaries a little bit.”

If my accountant president had stuck to the script and just stayed behind the podium and held on to both sides of that podium and looked down and just read like he was prepared to do, he never would have had that connection.

And I think this is the wonderful, as we said before, free opportunity for anybody to explore the range of you. You probably have, when you’re with your family or your friends, you’re at a sporting event or something, you’ve probably got that energy version of you.

So don’t switch it off just because you walk into work or you’ve turned on your Teams or your Zoom meeting for that business sales call. You can still bring your humanness to those things.

I worked with the chief technical officer for Pernod Ricard for a number of years, and I can share that because he’s on my LinkedIn page. But Pierre-Yves was very by the book. He was a native French speaker.

He was now, because their company was doing a lot of AI to help promote their market, their marketing and their sales funnels, he was in charge of a lot of that. So he was being asked to speak at a lot of English language native conferences where he not only had to work on some enunciation so he could be more easily understood, speaking in a second language, but he also didn’t want to just be getting too technical on the AI stuff.

He wanted to use stories and even shared more about himself to have that connection with the audience. And we had such a wonderful time that his assistant, who would be putting in our coaching times, even said to him, “I’m so happy when I get to put in another time that you’re working with Gina because I get to see how you progress all the time.”

And that’s really rewarding because people can amplify themselves while still being very true to themselves. And I think that’s the important thing to remember, too. This is not changing you. You are already a fully formed human being, but it is amplifying you, and these are some of the tools that you can use and they’re available for anybody.

Pete Mockaitis
Beautiful. Well. Gina, now could you share with us a favorite quote, something you find inspiring?

Gina London
I think one of the most important conversations I’ve had is about conversations, and it’s with the wonderful woman who wrote the foreword to my book, Susan Scott. So she wrote a book called Fierce Conversations. And her foundational premise, which is true, is that our conversations are our relationships.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. And can you share a favorite study or experiment or bit of research?

Gina London
Well, I also have the privilege of having Dr. Wendy Suzuki, she’s the head of the arts and science program over at NYU and she’s an author herself and a neuroscientist. And years ago, when I was working in the White House, and President Clinton was there, and this is the only thing that he taught me and nothing else to share.

But there’s a little technique of putting your thumb here on your palm, turning that palm around and putting a pressure on it, and it helps you go from reactive, maybe your face might be leaking something or the nerves might be coming up when you’re getting a difficult conversation, to keep your face and your voice in check.

And I asked Wendy if that, I said, “Is that a placebo or is that a valid thing?” She says, “No, no, no, this actually helps you go from the amygdala point of the trigger response, very emotional response, more into the prefrontal cortex.”

And so I don’t know if it was actually an experiment or a study, but it was validated by one of the top neuroscientists, and that makes me really happy because I’ve been transferring that and teaching that to my clients as well, as a way to keep yourself grounded when you’re feeling like, otherwise, you might leak some emotions that you don’t think are going to build your credibility or that connection.

Pete Mockaitis
Beautiful. So this sounds like an acupressure move, and Wendy Suzuki, she’s a guest on the show, so she must be right.

Gina London
She is. Of course, she is.

Pete Mockaitis
She has the imprimatur of How to be Awesome at Your Job. So let’s review. I grab a palm, one hand, and with my other hand, I put my thumb firmly in the dead center of the palm and put some pressure on it?

Gina London
Yes.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. Do I hold it for a while or…?

Gina London
Do I hold and how long? And does it make a difference if it’s my left thumb to my right? No, the idea here, really, is to give yourself that reminder that you are communicating even if you’re not saying a word.

So it’s usually used, I use it when I’m going on a stage or I’m in a panel or in a debate of some sort where I’m maybe getting a question that I’ve not expected, or maybe a client is asking me something that is out of scope, and I need to prepare a good response. I want to keep my face composed. I want to keep my pace slow and even.

So this just helps me remind myself to keep that game face on so that I can focus my brain matter not on the emotions and the cortisol that’s coming up, but on how I construct, “How can I purposefully go into my toolbox of techniques and land an answer that is going to continue to build that trust and that credibility going forward?”

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. And a favorite book?

Gina London
In the business sense right now, I’ve read a lot of them, but I really keep going back to The Coaching Habit by Michael Bungay Stainer. And I loved his book because it’s short, simple, and, most important for me, easy to apply.

Pete Mockaitis
Fabulous. And a favorite tool?

Gina London
Well, I won’t lie and say that I don’t use any of the AI bots. I’ve not gotten familiar with Claude. I do use ChatGPT. It’s become a real easy way to write quick emails. And I think, sometimes, when you’re doing, for example, my daughter has just gone off to college, and all the type of getting her into housing and all the follow-up that you do with student administrators and things, that can be a little bit emotionally charged.

So you can give that prompt. The ChatGPT tool doesn’t have any of that emotion that it’s caring about, “Which word should I use?” then it spits out something. But what’s really important, when we talk about this kind of a tool, and this is inherent, of course, in the book and for our own communication as well, is to not settle for the first thing that they come up with.

Look for, “Are those words that you would use? Would you sign off like that? Is it too flowery? Is it not warm enough?” Use it as a skeleton, but you put your own flesh on those types of things. I think that’s really important as more of us are using AI agents.

Pete Mockaitis
And a favorite habit?

Gina London
Favorite habit for me is making my bed.

Pete Mockaitis
Alrighty. And is there a key nugget you share that really seems to connect and resonate with folks, they quote it back to you often?

Gina London
The fact that you’re communicating always, either by default or by design.

Pete Mockaitis
All right. And if folks want to learn more or get in touch, where would you point them?

Gina London
You would go to my website, GinaLondon.com, or if you’d like to buy the book straight up, we have, obviously, a way that you can buy the book from my website. Or you can go ahead and buy it at any of the online places that you would purchase a book because it’s everywhere now.

And, certainly, if you want to follow me on any socials, I’m over on TikTok and Insta and my favorite place, though, is LinkedIn because that’s where a lot of the business and professional conversations are happening and I love to be there.

Pete Mockaitis
And do you have a final challenge or call to action for folks looking to be awesome at their jobs?

Gina London
Don’t think that you have fully arrived. When you get complacent about your communications, that’s when you start to slip. Your caring needs to constantly be cultivated. The same way I won’t get up and not make my bed, I also won’t get up without thinking about, “What’s my self-discipline? How can I add value to someone else? How can I help someone else?”

So one thing I think, also, is really important to remember is that when you’re feeling self-conscious about yourself, your communications, maybe your career path or whatever it is, the best way to heal that is to get more others-focused. So the more others-conscious you can be, the less self-conscious you’ll be as a result.

Pete Mockaitis
All right. Gina, thank you.

Gina London
Oh, it’s been a pleasure. Absolutely enjoyed it. I was digging the whole experience.