1094: How to Make Any Team Great with Steven Gaffney

Pete Mockaitis
Steven, welcome back!

Steven Gaffney
Thanks for having me.

Pete Mockaitis
Certainly. Well, it’s been almost three years since we last had you on the show. Could you share with us any super fascinating learnings, discoveries you’ve made in this meantime?

Steven Gaffney
We have a new study that just came out and it provides a lot of interesting stats, and I’ll just mention one. Sixty-nine percent of people report that being in the office is more productive than remote. It doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t ever work remotely, but it’s really insightful that that’s what the study reveals.

We also have around distractions and all kinds of stuff, which we can delve into. And our newest thing that we’ve just come out with over this past year is we’ve taken all of our content and now it’s online and interactive through AI, and it’s really the only system out there that builds effective teams for any level out there. So, a lot of organizations are now using it, so a lot of great stuff.

Pete Mockaitis
Well, that is nifty. Okay. Well, so in your study, the National Study on Consistently High-Achieving Teams, or CHAT, which is funny because the word chat feels so relaxed, and high-achieving sounds so hardcore, like the Navy SEALs.

So, tell us, so that’s an interesting stat right there, 69% of people find they’re more productive in the office, which is, well, that’s already intriguing because, I guess, 31% think just the opposite. So, if you force everyone to come to the office all the time, a good chunk of people are like, “Hey, actually, I’m doing worse here.”

Steven Gaffney
Well, it’s tricky, right? And I’m not saying again that people should not be working remotely ever or that hybrid is not effective. That’s not what I mean. But here’s what I do mean. There’s nothing ever going to take the place of being in the presence of another human being. There just isn’t, right? Do you remember with COVID, people said, “Oh, it’s going to change all kinds of behaviors”? It has changed some behaviors, but it’s like how people are social and whatnot.

And then now you see restaurants crowded, people traveling, a lot of things have obviously come back and this is not about COVID. It is about humanity and how we connect with each other. So, in business, when you’re having a critical meeting, is it worth bringing everybody together? Absolutely. Does it mean you should delay it for months to make that happen? No, I’m not saying that at all. What I am saying again, is it’s so important at times to make sure that we’re in the presence of another human being.

Pete Mockaitis
Well, while we’re there, can you share what are kind of the key factors that really make something ideal for in-person?

Steven Gaffney
Well, if you think about it, like a strategy meeting. Again, let’s take that for a moment. Could you do a strategic meeting over Zoom? Absolutely. Did we do many meetings and virtual training and still do that? Yes. But if it’s going to take, and where it’s a critical meeting, let’s say on a strategy, bring it together because here’s the reason why. When you call a break, people are going to talk to each other on the side. What are they going to do virtually? Call each other? Well, that could be the case.

But you run into people, you have outside conversations, you go to dinner, which produces another kind of social connection. There’s all kinds of benefits in bringing people together. So, again, we can go down this path, but all the work we do is around consistently high-achieving teams, it is about producing results. So, what’s going to produce the most effective results, and that’s how to make the decision.

Pete Mockaitis
Makes good sense. Now you’ve got seven key discoveries. And I know that’s a lot of key discoveries, but could you perhaps give us the one- or two-sentence version of the seven discoveries? We’ll have an overview and then we’ll dig into a few.

Steven Gaffney
So, we can go through many. But let me just give you one that’s really interesting. Thirty-nine percent of people reported that there’s little to no accountability in their teamwork. Now think about that. We all know accountability is critical, doing what you say and holding others accountable.

But if 39% of people are, essentially, saying it’s not existing in the team, that produces a great possibility to increase productivity by increasing accountability. And this is not about, you know, nagging at people. It’s about holding people accountable. In fact, let me give the listeners something really interesting to consider.

Medium-achieving teams are accountable to their boss or leaders, but great teams, consistently high-achieving teams, are accountable to each other, whether or not the boss or the leader is around. In fact, one of my clients, the whole focus is, the organization is doing pretty well, but it’s a lot leader-dependent. And so, our work came in there, and we can talk about how we did it.

But it’s, essentially, “How do you get everybody to interact so that, if the leader is on vacation or off to other meetings, the team runs as effectively as if they’re there?” I’m not saying leadership is not important. But I’m saying accountability is critically important.

Pete Mockaitis
That makes sense. Just so we’re super clear on what we mean by accountability, could you paint a picture for what it looks like in a team where there is little to no accountability, that 39%? So, let’s say, someone asks a colleague, “Oh, could you send me the numbers on the call center or performance last quarter?” And they say, “Sure.” And then three days later, it doesn’t happen. Like, what’s the little to no accountability view of what happens then versus the high-achieving accountability perspective?

Steven Gaffney
Well, let me just say, I wrote an article called “All-In Accountability” and they’re welcome to having that as well as the National Study. All they have to do is contact us at our website, JustBeHonest.com. But let me kind of address something that a lot of people don’t consider when we’re talking about accountability with a team – lack of honest communication.

But what I mean by honest communication is not about truth or lies, you know, people outwardly lying. The biggest problem is not what people say, it’s what they’re not saying to each other. It’s when we’ve walked in and work with a team and there’s a lot of unsaid not being said.

Like, here’s an example. Somebody’s dropping the ball, or somebody who’s only thinking about their area and not thinking about the entire team, or somebody who’s just really a jerk to deal with, difficult. Or, how about somebody who’s always complaining and never offers a solution, or somebody who’s always talking and never listens?

These are the kinds of things that we got to get the unsaid said about in a very productive way and work on resolution. That’s what I’m talking about. So, if I had to say one thing for people to focus on, it’s not what people are saying, it’s what they’re not saying to each other and the critical skillset is, “How do you get the unsaid said?”

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. So, one thing that’s left unsaid in that little scenario I put out there is like, “Hey, earlier you said that you were going to send this to me, and I don’t seem to have it.” So, it’s just the saying of it?

Steven Gaffney
Right. But here’s where it really gets interesting. When the person goes, “I’m sorry, I made a mistake. I’ll do a better job next time.” And then they keep doing the problem. So, people often will say to me, “What do I do in that situation?”

Again, you got to get the unsaid said, which is, “Hey, I want to talk to you about these missed deadlines.” “Oh, I’m sorry. I’m going to do better.” “Well, wait a minute. We’ve had that conversation before.” And then you want to say, “I’m not blaming you, but how do we work together so I can hold you accountable and you can hold me accountable?”

And here’s the critical question, “What’s going to be different as we move forward? Because I don’t want to nag you? I don’t want to pester you. How do we rely on each other and work together?” That’s the type of thing I’m talking about.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. Well, while we’re trying to do more saying of the unsaid, are there any best or worst practices that you’d highlight?

Steven Gaffney
Sure. So, let me highlight three. First, ask the key question. Whatever the question we most want to ask and are afraid to ask, that’s really the one. Let me give you an example. I was doing a session in Philadelphia and this lady came up to me, and she said, “Look, I’m really worried about my job.” And I said, “Well, why don’t you ask your boss, your leader, the person you report to, ‘How am I doing at my job? Am I doing the job you want me to?’” And she started to get teary-eyed.

And I said, “Wait, what’s going on?” She said, “Well, I’m afraid to ask.” And I said, “Well, what’s the worst that your leader or boss could say?” And she goes, “I’m afraid he’s going to say I’m not doing a great job.” My response to her is, “When’s a good time to find that out?”

If we’re afraid that we’re not doing a great job with whoever we’re reporting to, or a customer, and even like at home, what we’re most afraid to ask is usually the question we need to ask. Because, as I often say to people, “What’s the worst-case scenario?” and then, “When would be a good time to find that out?” As soon as possible. That’s the type of thing I’m talking about.

So, asking questions would be number one. A second one is, create that emotional safety. And emotional safety is an upgrade from psychological safety. So, we hear a lot about psychological safety, but I’ve been in the workforce for over 30 years doing this type of work. And I can tell you, people can cognitively, psychologically get it’s okay to speak up, but sometimes they feel afraid.

So, we want to create that emotional safety. And one of ways to look at is people get defensive. Have you ever had somebody say to you, “Listen, you can give me any kind of feedback, please, any kind. I’m really open to it”? So, you give them constructive criticism and then they get mad. You’re like, “What’s going on here?”

And then the next time they ask you for feedback, you’re like, “I’m not going there.” So, we can actually train and condition people to lie to us by our reaction. And that happens a lot with teams. So, leaders need to, and people need to regulate when people are using an awful tone, getting defensive, because that will shut down people speaking up.

Pete Mockaitis
Certainly. And then, I suppose, in practice, this is, indeed, emotional stuff. People feel scared. People feel defensive. How do we deal with this messy human emotion stuff, Steven?

Steven Gaffney
So, the best thing is, if we’re just talking about emotions for a moment, is to embrace the emotion you feel. Carl Jung said, “What we resist persists.” And have you ever been, like, feeling down, and somebody goes, “Well, just cheer up”? Don’t you want to just look at that person and go, “That’s groundbreaking. I never thought, ‘If I’m down, all I have to do is cheer up.’”

Or how about this when you’re stressed, and somebody goes, “Don’t get stressed.” Just look at them, and go, “That’s brilliant. All I have to do is not be stressed. If I knew it, I wouldn’t do that, right?” So, part of it is embracing the emotion and giving ourself the permission that it’s okay to feel that way. And then turn to say, “What am I going to do about it?”

So, here’s an example. Let’s say you work for somebody that’s really tough, right? They say they want open-door policy, you can say to them anything, and you give them some feedback, and they get upset. Maybe the getting the unsaid said could be, and I’ve coached people to do this, is go to the person and say, “Listen, I’m worried about sometimes talking to you because I notice I bring things up and it seems like you get upset, and I don’t want to upset you.”

“So how can I best bring up things that are not always the best things to bring up?” In other words, bad news. “What can I do? Because sometimes I feel like I’m walking on eggshells. Again, I’m not blaming you. It’s just how I feel.” And so that’s what I’m talking about. So, embrace and then figure, “Okay, what am I going to do about it?” Does that help?

Pete Mockaitis
Yes. Yes, indeed. And it’s interesting, you might get all kinds of responses to that. And that could be surprising from, “Oh, well, please try to do it privately,” “Please try to give me a super specific example,“ “Please try to connect that to our results or KPIs or business objectives,” or, “Hey, yeah, I’m just hot-headed. I’m going to yell sometimes, and I’m sorry. It doesn’t mean I hate you. That’s just probably going to happen. And so, my apologies but it doesn’t mean anything bad.

And you’d be like, “Oh, okay. So, you’re telling me you might yell at me, but it’s not a big deal. Not what I was expecting, but that’s more useful than not having that context.”

Steven Gaffney
Yes. So, let me talk about this for a moment. One of the big reasons why people get defensive or upset when somebody is just bringing up some negative stuff is because they don’t offer solutions. Have you ever been around somebody who is just offering constructive criticism, but they never offer solutions? So that can be wearing on other people.

So perhaps that person might say, “Well, look, the reason why is because you just dumped a complaint in the news or bad information, which, okay, but I want to hear some solutions. We’ve got to work together,” so maybe that’s it. So, I’m not saying that’s the reason, but it could be a reason, but again, it comes back to getting the unsaid said.

I’ll give you something else to consider. A lot of people are clueless about how they come across. I know that seems weird, right? And there’s all this about emotional intelligence, but I’ve worked with a lot of people and a lot of leaders who they know they’re about coming across, it could be tough with people. They don’t know how it’s landing with people.

Another thing to consider that I found really fascinating over the years is poor performers receive poor feedback. Now, I know that sounds odd, like, “Wouldn’t poor performers get a lot of feedback that they’re not doing a great job?” But I’ve worked with a lot of people who are, turns out, are not doing well and I’m hired to work with them.

And so often, people just haven’t told them. In fact, haven’t you ever heard this? Because of all your great podcasts and doing the work you’re doing, but have you ever heard of how leaders will sometimes inherit an employee that is obviously not doing the job? And you look at their performance reviews, and they’re stellar, and it’s like, “What’s going on?”

So, then you go contacting maybe other people from the company that maybe transferred this person, and you find out the problem was there, but people didn’t want to deal with it. Again, poor performers receive poor feedback. It’s always about getting good actionable feedback.

Pete Mockaitis
Absolutely. Yeah, we had Kim Scott on the show, talking about radical candor, as well as an employment lawyer who said, “Whenever there’s a wrongful termination suit, it’s always the defense who brings up the performance reviews.”

It was like, “Well, all these reviews said they were doing great. They were meeting expectations year after year after year.” It’s like, “Oh, well, you know, they don’t.” It’s hard to say to the judge, “Well, yeah, but our performance review process is kind of bull, and we just sort of rush through the perfunctory checkboxes to get that done.”

Steven Gaffney
Well, I can also tell you something interesting, bringing up the legal aspect. A lot of leaders are worried about, “How do you give feedback so it goes well?” And often, in this day and age, where people want to litigate things and file complaints, it is challenging.

So, I’ve been brought in many situations where there might be an investigation going on. And what’s happened? Because a leader came in, wanted to change the culture, and the people that weren’t doing a great job started filing complaints. Now, sometimes they’re valid, but quite often they’re not valid. And so, again, I’m not a lawyer, so I can’t comment legal things. But what I can say is, having worked with so many people, it’s fearful to sometimes get feedback because they’re worried about the backlash.

So, we’ve developed a nine-step methodology on how to give effective feedback and have it work. If they want that, please contact us, again at our JustBeHonest.com website. They got to mention your show and we’ll send them this about how to have difficult conversations, The National Study, and there was something, oh, about “All-In Accountability.” All of that, we’ll give them. But it’s really about having really critical feedback, but a lot of times people are afraid to.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. Understood. Well, so that’s accountability. Another key discovery was associated with distractions. Tell us about this.

Steven Gaffney
Yeah, it’s amazing. Another staggering statistic, 37% of people reported being distracted in their job and in meetings. And what’s interesting is how often people reported about just being out to lunch. They just don’t want to deal with the meeting, so they just disconnect. I mean, if have you ever watched a meeting, you’ll see how people disconnect. They’ll look at people, but they’re really not involved, or they’re actively not involved.

And what we also found out is 39% of companies don’t have a way to manage distractions. They don’t make it critically clear what’s appropriate and what’s not appropriate. So, I’ve been brought into watch meetings and seen people texting under the table, on their laptop, and I’m not talking about taking notes. I’m talking about just distractions. And the leader doesn’t even say anything.

Like, I’ll share with you an interesting story. So, some years back, I was brought in to work with this team. And the leader of the team, who’s responsible for about a billion dollars, had the head of business development in the middle of the team meeting start texting, not one phone, but he had two phones. So, it was a huge distraction and I’m observing it.

So, afterwards I said to who ended up being my client, “Why are you allowing this?” And he said, “Well, I’m just afraid to confront him because he has so many connections with our customers. I’m just afraid to really do this, that he’s going to get upset.” Again, it’s the inability to manage distractions. It’s an easy fix. You just say to people, “Look, when we’re in the meeting, no use of texting or emailing or whatever. We’re in the meeting. We’re going to get in and out of that meeting.” So, people don’t really manage distractions really well.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. So, there’s just the decree, “This is how we do it.” And so, any other pro tips on the distractions?

Steven Gaffney
Well, it depends on what kind of distractions are going on. So, part of it is also watching group dynamics. So, for example, let’s say somebody dominates, a good leader has got to manage that accordingly. Or, how about somebody who just keeps rambling on and on and not getting to the point?

I was working with another team that was an international team and they had one leader in particular is when it was coming to share, he was saying his point but then going on and on and on. So, I pulled him aside and said, “The longer you talk, people are losing your point.”

So, he said, “What do you think I should do?” I said, “Why don’t you just say, ‘My point is,’ or, ‘We’re rambling,’ saying, ‘My point is,’ and coming back to it.” Now some of these seem to be like such easy fixes but, quite often, they are easy fixes. Again, it’s just going back to giving that person feedback. That would be another example.

Pete Mockaitis
And when you say, to that point, they’re often easy fixes and people are, often just, have no clue how they come across, this reminds me of our conversation with Dr. Tasha Eurich about how we’re less self-aware than we think for the most part. What are your top suggestions for how we can, generally, get a clue and figure out, “Oh,” so that we burst our bubbles quicker? I guess, you say just ask. But how else do we figure out what’s the stupidly simple thing I should start doing or stop doing that will just make me way better?

Steven Gaffney
Well, besides asking, what we also need to do is rewarding feedback. And it can’t be just, “Thanks for sharing.” It has to be, “What are we going to do with that information?” Have you ever had somebody ask you for feedback, you give them feedback, but they keep repeating the same problem? And after a while, you just say, “Forget it”?

Well, how about somebody in your personal life who is just having the same problem over and over again, and they’re always asking or complaining around the situation, but they don’t do anything different? We have to reward people with feedback. And one of the ways to reward the feedback is to do something with it. So that’s one thing.

So, we’ve covered asking questions, creating that emotional safety, rewarding feedback. But I’ll give you the overall thing that we really need to consider. Are we surrounding and supporting people who are willing to speak the truth? You know, really? It’s hard to do. So, are we interviewing? Are we creating situational questions when we’re interviewing people to make sure that they’re good fit and they are going to get the unsaid said?

A good question to ask somebody when you’re interviewing them is, “Tell me a time when you disagreed with your boss and how you handled it.” And they say, “Well, you know, I just gave some feedback and I just moved forward.” That’s not really the desire.

I’ll give you one of the best responses I’ve ever had when I’ve interviewed someone on this question. She said, “Well, there was a time I disagreed with my boss, so I presented something. He disagreed. So, I went back, took that feedback. I was really passionate about that idea.”

“So, I retooled that idea in light of the feedback and then came back and re-approached my boss with the newer version of that idea, and then he went forward with it.” So, what did that tell me? It told me that, when she really believes in something, she’s going to do something, but she isn’t going to be belligerent, right? But she’s going to take in the feedback and do something, and she was a fantastic assistant. That’s what I’m talking about.

So, look at how we interview, that’s another thing, but just as a whole, how we’re surrounding ourselves by people. And then are we asking questions, creating that emotional safety and rewarding that feedback?

Pete Mockaitis
All right. Well, now let’s hear a bit about your mindset discovery.

Steven Gaffney
The big thing around the mindset kind of goes back to this whole powerless distinction we talked about a couple years ago. So, have you ever noticed that when you’re in a good mood, you’re smarter? So, when we’re in a good mood, we’re just smarter. So, we identified three types of mood, or you could say mindset.

The first mindset is a powerless mood or mindset. That’s the feeling we sometimes feel when we’re defeated, resigned, you know, “What difference can I make? You know, there’s all these problems.” The second type of mood or mindset is conditionally powerful. And conditionally powerful means we recognize that we have power over the situation, but it’s conditional on other things.

That’s the kind of mindset where people say, “Well, you know, I can do that as long as you give me more money,” or, “As long as there’s more resources,” or, “As long as we have better talent,” or, “As long as there’s not that bureaucracy,” or, “As long as the market’s changed.” There’s always some condition. But the desirable mood or mindset of a great team, of great individuals is unconditionally powerful.

Unconditionally powerful means we recognize there are conditions, but we spend 100% of our time on what we’re going to do about it. I’ll give you an example. In 2009, I got diagnosed with cancer, and that was in the middle of also the big recession.

So, I was faced with a tremendous amount of headwind, and I thought to myself, “Okay, well, I have cancer,” that’s just the end story. This is now, I’m completely fine. I had cancer, but the key question is, “What was I going to do about it? Am I going to spend time on that I have cancer or going to spend time on how I’m going to respond and what am I going to do about it? We’re in the middle of the recession. I can’t change the recession, but I can look at how we’re operating our business.”

So, I took that as an opportunity to retool my entire business. Because, again, I can’t change the stimulus or what’s coming at me, but I can change how I respond. And from that year on, we’ve had our best years ever in business. It’s not because I’m that smart. It’s just because I recognize it’s foolish to spend energy on things we can’t control. Yet people do spend a lot of time on what they can’t control.

Watch how many people complain about whether it’s politics, markets, or whatever. That might be interesting dialogue, but what are you going to do about it? So that’s true about work, and it’s true about personal life. Being unconditionally powerful and focus 100% of our energy on what we can do about it.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. Well, we’re all glad that you are well and have come out successfully there. So, let’s zoom in on cancer in terms of what does the powerless mindset sound like in response versus the unconditional power? Like, what are the things one does when one discovers that there’s cancer?

Steven Gaffney
In full disclosure, my cancer was testicular cancer, which on the spectrums of cancer is very easy to take care of. I did have an operation, went through chemo, so it’s not a piece of cake, but it’s not as, like, where other cancers are really endowed or odds are way against them and type of thing. So, I want to put that in perspective.

Having said that, I can tell you, when I first got the diagnosis, I was completely down. In fact, you know, I pride myself on being very positive. I’ll never forget the doctor said, “You have a 90% chance that this is going to work.” And I remember driving home and thinking, “There’s 10% I’m going to die.” I was focused on the 10%.

And then I had to kind of wake up and deal with the situation. So, we all have those normal reactions. But then you look at who are we around, and sometimes it’s important to have a great support structure to pick you up when you’re down and whatnot. And so, eventually, where I came out with is, “Okay, what am I going to do about this?”

So how that looked is, “Okay, I have to go through the operation, got to go through chemo. That is the way it is. But what am I going to do about this?” So, I hired some people to cover some of the things that I couldn’t get done. And then I looked around, a lot of the people around me in my life, and who are really good fits and who’s not. And why I’m saying that is, you ever notice that when you’re challenged in life, you really find out who your really great friends are?

And it’s not always that obvious, because I remember, there are certain people that I thought would definitely step up and they didn’t, and then other people I never thought would step up and they did. So, everybody wants to be along for the party, but during difficult times it’s an opportunity to really recalibrate your life.

So, those are the types of things, and I’ve developed some wonderful, wonderful friendships, changed a lot of things in my life, but again, “What am I going to do about it?” So, I want to put it in perspective of the type of cancer I have. But the principle still holds true no matter what challenge we’re going through is what are we going to do about it? That’s the key question.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. And can you share with us, if we’re having trouble thinking of something, because you say when you feel good, you’re smarter, when we feel bad, we’re dumber, if we’re feeling pretty bad and powerless, and we’re thinking, “What can I do about this? Hmm, well, Steven, that’s the trouble. Nothing comes to mind. I guess I’m feeling dumber.” Are there some go-to’s that we can always do?

Steven Gaffney
Well, first, an interesting mindset is to remember every problem creates an opportunity. Every problem creates an opportunity. I’m not saying every problem is a good thing. People say, “Oh, you know, it’s got his way of working and stuff like that.” That’s way above my pay grade. I’m very simple. There’s a problem. There’s always going to be an opportunity.

So, there was an opportunity for me to calibrate my life and whatnot. There’s always things that I think are really important to do on the mindset. I will say this, though. Overall, we need to be vulnerable in our life and ask for help. Quite often, we’re just doing it alone in life. And this is, you know, how vulnerable are we being?

So, let’s say you’re leading a team. It could be a small team, whatever. And you don’t have all the answers. Instead of, like, being down about it, maybe it’s a great opportunity to say to the team, “Look, I know we can pull through this. I just don’t have the answers. So, let’s spend some time and brainstorm all the ideas we can come up with on how we’re going to respond to this situation.” So, in other words, lean on people.

Quite often people are suffering in silence, instead of being vulnerable and asking for help. That’s one thing or another thing you can do is be vulnerable.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. What else?

Steven Gaffney
Well, I mean, as far as the cancer, just tough situations, well, there’s a lot of things that I put into the book, Unconditional Power, along that. But another really critical around is doing intentional disruption. So, we’ve all felt down. It could be on a, let’s put it on a more simpler basis. You get an email that brings you down, something’s disparaging, or you have a call that doesn’t go well.

If you wallow in it, it can often make it worse. I’m not saying not to embrace it, but if we wallow in it and just sit there. So, intentional disruption is a fantastic strategy, because you disrupt a pattern that is not working for you. So, what it might look like is you get up from your seat, you might go take a walk or go for a run or call a friend that makes you laugh.

Like, I have a good buddy of mine, his name is Reza Khederi. I can always call him, and no matter what state I’m in, he’ll make me laugh. He’ll always come up with some kind of joke or interesting insight. Like, I’ll give you an example. One time I was down, and he said, “Remember, even our worst days are somebody else’s best days ever.” Even our worst days are somebody’s best day ever.

In other words, really appreciate what you have. Now, again, it sounds obvious, but it’s really good to kind of reach out. And so, we build that friendship and then reach out, so intentional disruption. And there’s also mental intentional disruption, right? Instead of saying, “Why is this happening?” I could say, “What am I going to do about this? What’s it going to take for me to move forward?” Or, here’s a good question, “Can I live with it?”

Three great questions you can always ask yourself and ask other people that will always interrupt any negative pattern is, “What would you suggest? What would it take for you to agree? And can you live with it?” “What would you suggest?” is great, because if you’ve ever had somebody negative come at you and you just say, “Well, what would you suggest?”

Or, you propose something and it doesn’t go well, “Well, what would it take for you to agree?” Or sometimes you just got to ask somebody and say, “Okay, I get you’re upset. Is this a deal breaker or can you live with it?” So, interrupt your own pattern as well as others.

Pete Mockaitis
All right. Thank you. Well, tell me Steven, anything else you really want to make sure to mention before we hear about some of your favorite things?

Steven Gaffney
Well, the thing I want to come back to is, whether they go to us or not, is to look at all the available online learning that is out there. So, whether it’s, well, there’s many, even we were talking about earlier. But we have a new system out, and if they mention your show, we’ll give them the first month for free. And what it is, is we have an online system that helps all leaders turn any team into a great team.

So, they can have a month of that for free, and its access to all our content. And what really makes it interesting is there’s an AI overlay. So, they don’t have to really study the system. All they have to do is ask the internal system, “I’m working through a difficult time and not collaborating well with another team,” or, “We’re lacking trust issues,” or, “We’re trying to achieve some extremely high goals. What do I do?”

The AI answers it. And then there’s videos that you can show with your team on how exactly to execute on that. So, we have a whole online system that is available to them and we’ll give them the first month for free, as long as they mention your show, of course.

Pete Mockaitis
All right. Thank you. Well, now could you share a favorite quote, something you find inspiring?

Steven Gaffney
Albert Einstein, “There’s two ways to live your life. One is though nothing is a miracle. The other is though everything is. The choice is yours.” I love that quote.

Pete Mockaitis
All right. And a favorite book?

Steven Gaffney
Switch: How to Change Things When Change Is Hard.

Pete Mockaitis
All right. And a favorite tool, something you use to be awesome at your job?

Steven Gaffney
AI, I think, is critical, right, ChatGPT or some of the other ones that are critical. But I’ll tell you why this is so important is, and again, I know it makes mistakes and there’s a lot of things, but it really speeds up what we’re able to do.

I know that sounds obvious, but you got to embrace it and use it. And I’ll tell you how we’re hiring now is I want people to think of AI first, AI-first mentality. In other words, if you’re doing a task, could you offset, use some form of program around AI first? I want that to be the inkling first because it speeds up how we respond to our customers as well.

Pete Mockaitis
All right. And a favorite habit?

Steven Gaffney
Exercise, that’s critical.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. And is there a key nugget you share that you’re really known for, people quote back to you often?

Steven Gaffney
“Getting the unsaid said.”

Pete Mockaitis
All right. And if folks want to learn more or get in touch, where would you point them?

Steven Gaffney
They can go to our website, JustBeHonest.com. And again, if they mention the show, what do we say? So, I just want to make sure we get the study, right? So, I’m holding the study. They can get the “All-In Accountability,” and also how to have difficult conversations, as well as that whole month access to that whole online system that’ll help them with any teamwork.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. Cool. Thanks. And do you have a final challenge for folks looking to be awesome at their jobs?

Steven Gaffney
Appreciate. So, people are stingy with their appreciations. They just are. And part of it is obvious, “Okay, well, I’m going to appreciate my employees.” But how often do you appreciate your boss, your friends, and things like that? People are stingy. And I’ll tell you, I’ve never heard anybody leaving a job because they were appreciated too much, “Can’t stand it. Got to get out of here. Too much appreciation.”

It just doesn’t happen. So, could people do it too much? Maybe, but I just haven’t seen it. The point is, take time and appreciate the people around you.

And I don’t mean just saying thank you. Just show them something, or at least say, “Hey, look, I noticed you changed this behavior. It means a lot that you’ve changed it.” Somehow appreciate people.

Pete Mockaitis
All right. Steven, thank you.

Steven Gaffney
Thank you.