738: How to Get Inspired and Be Inspiring with Alise Cortez

Pete Mockaitis
Alise, welcome to How to be Awesome at Your Job.

Alise Cortez
Thanks, Pete. Thanks for having me. It’s great to be on the other end of the mic.

Pete Mockaitis
Well, I’m excited to be chatting with you and to hear about your wisdom when it comes to purpose and inspiration and fighting burnout. But, first, I want to hear, you had an aspiration as a youth, tell us about this.

Alise Cortez
Yeah, let’s just be thankful that things change and evolve over time and, hopefully, very quickly. So, Pete, when I was in my elementary school years, and I asked a lot of people this when I’m doing my interviews with them, what do they want to be when they were young, like in elementary school, and I had a very, very strong singular aspiration in the second grade to become a horse.

And that was because my mother was married five times by the time she was 28. She finally found Mr. Right with her fifth marriage when I was in the second grade, and he moved us to this farm and I had my own horse, he was my best friend, and I thought, “Wow, if a being can be that magnificent, I want to be one of those.”

So, I, literally, Pete, would go around, I had two young siblings at the time, I would literally go around practicing being a horse. And so, I’d get on all fours and I’d give them rides on my back, and I practiced my whinny, and I was ready to be a horse. And my parents were, of course, horrified. I don’t know how long it took me to outgrow that, but that was my first aspiration.

Pete Mockaitis
Well, it’s interesting, they say, which is that’s a great question, “What do you want to do?” when you were little in terms of upon growing up, and there are often clues in that about your interests and passions and things. Tell me, were there some things about horses that connected to what you’re doing now?

Alise Cortez
What a thoughtful, beautiful question. As you ask me the question, I can connect the dots. No one has ever asked me that before, but, yeah, there’s something about, for me, horses are magnificent. They are elegant. They are elevated. They are graceful. And so, the work that I do today is so much is about stewarding consciousness. That’s so much of the work that I do.

And, yeah, so we’re on stewarding individual lives, organizations upward and toward magnificence, toward elegance, towards something bigger and beautiful, more beautiful. So, yeah, I think I can connect it, my fascination with horses to what I do now.

Pete Mockaitis
Cool. All right. Well, so now let’s chat a little bit about some purpose. You’ve got a new book, Purpose Ignited. What’s the big idea here?

Alise Cortez
Yeah, the big idea here is that each and every single one of us have the capacity and, frankly, the responsibility to be able to ignite that which is already within us in terms of our energy, our passion, our vitality. It’s always there and available to us but we lose it along the way in life as we go out and get burnt out and we get overwhelmed, etc. but it’s always there. And so, the book really teaches us how to remain vigilant and develop it and exercise it on a daily basis, first, as individuals and then as inspirational leaders.

Pete Mockaitis
All right. Well, tell us, when it comes to, I’m thinking a little bit about if someone is listening and you’re an individual and you are not yet having direct reports but you are feeling your inspiration, motivation sagging and maybe burnout on the rise, what would you recommend are some of the top things they should do?

Alise Cortez
Oh, yeah, I got this, Pete. I got this. Okay. So, I haven’t introduced myself as a management consultant specializing in meaning and purpose and an organizational logotherapist but now is the time to do so. So, when it comes to logotherapy, what that really speaks to is healing and vitality through meaning. And I don’t think you can go a day without hearing about purpose and meaning, but what the heck are they, right? And how do we actually get to them?

So, as a logotherapist, a lot of the work that I’m doing is about helping people to access meaning in their lives and their work because when they do so, that is their ultimate turn-on mechanism, their ultimate energy source, essentially. That’s what logotherapy teaches and that’s what I embrace.

So, what I would say is I’ll share with you there are three principal sources of meaning according to logotherapy and when we can each access those and learn to presence them in the moment to moments of our lives, the more energy that we have and the more irresistible we’d become to other people. So, I’ll share those really quick, but before I do, do you want me to speak just to the individual piece or do you want me to speak to this model first?

Pete Mockaitis
Well, yeah, let’s hear about the individual and then the model.

Alise Cortez
Okay. So, let’s go back to from an individualistic vantage point. We each and every one of us have access to this notion of meaning in the everyday moments of our life and across our lives, and yet it’s up to us to be able to find that. And the more meaning we can find in our lives, the more lifted we are, the more energetic we are, and, frankly, the more irresistible we are to other people.

So, what does that speak to? How do we translate that to the world of work? As individuals, one, when we really understand what it is that lights us up, what do we love, we can opt-in to those opportunities and let anything else go that doesn’t actually fit that path or that pattern, if you will. And then, two, when are leading other people, or we want to lead other people, even if we’ve never done that before, when we’re so up to something that turns us on and lights us up and we’re passionate about, that is what is irresistible to others.

In fact, what we’ve learned in the leadership space, Pete, is that there’s all different kinds of ways that leadership has been taught about, categorized, and tried to develop over the years, but where we have come to with a lot of common ground with thought leaders in the same space is the one thing that we really need is inspiration.

We need inspirational leaders who actually show us the possibilities, something much bigger than ourselves, that makes us feel like we’re part of something much bigger than ourselves and that we belong to that, and helps us grow into the best version of ourselves. So, individually, what we really need is that path to meaning to steward us toward that higher being in ourselves.

Pete Mockaitis
Cool. All right. Well, so then, I’m curious, if we’re doing our own introspection and we want to tap into that ultimate energy source and get some more of that, how do we come to get a great understanding of what really lights us up?

Alise Cortez
Yeah, okay. So, then I want to get into the model then. So, according to logotherapy, there’s three principal sources of meaning. And so, the first one is creative, and that is what we give of ourselves to the world, that we can uniquely give of ourselves to the world. And I translate that word to passion. So, what is it that you can’t not do in the world? If nobody was looking and nobody paid you, what would you do? That’s the stuff and it’s always the thing that you put yourself into.

So, for me, as an example, one of the things for me is I have to go find someone on a daily basis that I can uplift. So, even if it’s in the grocery store, even if it’s walking down the sidewalk, I look for someone that I can say something kind about, not because I want something, Pete, but because when I do that, the act of giving that unique message from me to them lifts me, and that’s the energy source back that I’m talking about.

So, the more that we, one, know what our passions are and, two, exercise them, the more energy we get. So, when I’m out speaking with audiences, Pete, and I ask people that question, I ask an audience of a hundred people, five hundred people, a thousand people, “What are you passionate about?” Guess, Pete, what the number one response is?

Pete Mockaitis
Helping people?

Alise Cortez
Yeah, I’ll get that as a little response here and there. Some people will say families, some will say travel, but the universal response more in common is, “I don’t know.”

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. That was so funny. I was about to say I don’t know because I didn’t know. But I thought, “I want to give her a good guess. Let’s see.” I was like, “Wine, coffee, travel. Let’s go with helping people.”

Alise Cortez
Right. But those, again, are not really passion because those are just things you enjoy. You’re not putting yourself into them unless you’re like savoring the moment and letting the juices run down your chin as you drink that coffee or drink that wine or whatever. So, passion is your first source of meaning. The second source is experiential, and this is what the world gives you in the way of encounters and experiences, and I translate that to inspiration.

So, those are the moments that literally breathe life into yourself as you experience them, and so they are interactions, encounters. People might then say things like, “Travel is an inspiration,” or, “Watching somebody do something really amazing or great.” So, for me, there’s lots of sources of inspiration, and hosting my radio show is one of them. Each week, I’m having an amazing conversation with somebody who teaches me something, so that breathes something into me.

And then the third source of meaning is attitudinal. So, one important thing to understand is all of these sources have to surround themselves around a value that you hold. So, whatever it is, I value empowerment so, therefore, lifting others is part of the reason that giving of those experiences to others is meaningful to me. I value learning and growth, so hosting a radio show is why that works for me as an inspiration.

So, the attitudinal is that becomes a source of meaning when, especially when you face an encounter or faith in life that you cannot control but you turn that into the ability to recognize it as an achievement, but for the way that you allow yourself to put an attitude toward it, or your mindset. So, the one thing that we always have control over, Pete, no matter what, is the attitude that we take against whatever circumstances life puts forth through us. And it is that which we have control, and that is our brand.

So, whether you’re an optimist, or whether you’re somebody that say, “Oh, woe is me. I’m a victim,” all that is true because your mind told you that. So, you have an opportunity to be able to architect that mindset. And, for me, it’s all about, “What will you do with your one precious life? You have just one of them, what are you going to do?”

I just watched, by the way, last night, “14 Peaks.” If that is not inspirational and doesn’t teach you the sheer power of mindset, I do not know what does. Have you seen it?

Pete Mockaitis
I have not.

Alise Cortez
Oh, it’s incredible. It’s about a Nepalese man who finds a team against all odds. He summits the 14 tallest mountains over 8,000 meters – is it meters? – in less than seven weeks. Yeah, it’s amazing. It’s truly amazing.

Pete Mockaitis
Less than a week’s rest between each.

Alise Cortez
It’s like phenomenal. But that, Pete, is the power of the human spirit. And when you convince yourself, and you have that kind of a mindset powering your sails, there’s nothing you really can’t do.

Pete Mockaitis
That’s cool. That’s cool. So, okay, we got the three categories – the creative, the experiential, and the attitudinal. What discovery process or key introspection questions might you recommend we engage in to really zero in on a clear bullseye for these pieces for us individually?

Alise Cortez
Yeah, great question. And, by the way, you have a great voice, Pete.

Pete Mockaitis
Thank you.

Alise Cortez
You’re welcome. So, first, the creative, right? I can tell you that so many people have left their passions go over the years as they became “an adult.” So, there were things that you loved when you were a kid, in your earlier years, and you let them go because, oh, you didn’t have time anymore, you’re working, whatever, or there’s additional nuance that have come along that you just haven’t given time over to because you’re busy with other adult matters.

And so, really finding those things that literally light you up when you do them, and pay attention. Ask your friends, ask your family, “What do you think that I love?” They’ll tell you. They’ll know. You’re just the only one that forgot. So, first, giving space in your life for those things even if it’s only 15 minutes a day or some time per week because it’s the act of giving yourself over to those passions that gives you that vital energy back.

On the experiential front, I actually had somebody at my workshop last week asked me this very same question. She knew what her passion was, it was totally giving herself over into her children, but she didn’t know how to identify an inspiration. And I said, “Well, I think that’s a matter of paying attention to look around you.” For a lot of people, it’s nature, it’s beautiful music, it’s art, it’s being or hearing about phenomenal stories.

Like, for me, I think Nelson Mandela is one of the most inspirational human beings I’ve ever known about. That he can devote his whole life to this idea of exercising apartheid. It’s just amazing to me. So, if you look around, there’s so much to be inspired by. It’s just what do you value? Do you value eradicating world hunger? Do you care about climate change? Do you care about economic improvement in your backyard? When you go looking for the things that you value, and then you go see, “Who’s doing something about those things? Or, what’s doing something about those things?” I can guarantee you, you will find some kind of inspiration in that front.

On the attitudinal space, first and most importantly, examine what is governing you today. When you think about how you make decisions and what goes through your mind throughout the day, one thing that people do, Pete, is they’ll set like a timer every hour or every two hours, and in that moment just quickly record what was on their mind. And then you can start to see the pattern of what actually shows up in your mind throughout the day, “Oh, man, I’m constantly thinking about how bad my life is,” or, “I’m doing this wrong,” or whatever it is.

So, when you get a handle on what is that governing pattern of what guides your life and your thoughts, because most of the time we’re on autopilot for that. We don’t even know what is our mindset. You have to bring it to your awareness. And one way to do that is to record your thoughts for some period of time – every hour, a couple of hours – to bring that to light. And then just see how is that serving you, how is that working for you.

Pete Mockaitis
Cool. All right. Well, could you maybe tie this together with a story of someone who was feeling low on the inspiration, and then they did some discovery around these points and had a transformation?

Alise Cortez
Yeah, I was thinking about that. I didn’t know if you were going to ask me about a story, but I thought, “Gosh, I want to bring this home.” So, my PhD is in human development, and I started meaning in work and identity when I was doing my research. And then, several years later, I decided to expand that postdoc research into something much bigger, and I interviewed 150 men and women across 20 different professions about their experience of work and how their person was related to it, and I found these 15 modes of engagement.

I was getting towards the end of the data collection, Pete. I might get 110 people, I want 115, and I needed another chef as one of my categories. And I found somebody who had been referred to me, I called him up, I say, “Hey, I’m doing this research. It’s about meaning in work,” and he goes, “Oh, Alise, you don’t want to interview me. I hate my job.” And I’m like, “I definitely want to talk to you because I’m trying to understand the full spectrum of experience. Please, can we talk?”

So, we scheduled the in-person 90-minute interview at his restaurant, and I came one evening at like 6:00 o’clock and we had dinner together at his restaurant, and I interviewed him. And during the course of that 90-minute conversation, Pete, he fell into a pile of tears no less than five times. He was so miserable. He hated the fact that his family was at home while he was a chef working Friday, Saturday nights, all the weekends, and they were living while he was working.

He felt like he was trapped in his job. He made a lot of money, and he said, “I’m beholden to this because I have to pay my ex-wife all this alimony. My boss is a jerk. He yells at me every day. I walk on egg shells. I don’t get to serve the menu I want. I got to do what they do.” He just was so miserable. So, I finished collecting all this data, it was 2800 pages. I go and analyze all this data, and I come up with these 15 modes of engagement, all the way from transcendental connection, which is the highest, most fulfilled, to living your purpose, and all the way down to number 15, which is existential crisis, which is where I found him to be.

So, part of my research design involved sharing with each of my participants, “Here’s what I came up with. Here’s what I came up with the results. Here are the 15 modes of engagement. Here’s the one that I think you were exhibiting when we interviewed you. Do you agree? And since I’ve interviewed you, do you think you’ve changed modes, and to which one?” So, Pete, the day I go to, I scheduled the conversation with this guy, his pseudonym is McKinney, I am not looking forward to this conversation. Who wants to tell somebody they’re in existential crisis?

Pete Mockaitis
“It looks like you’re the worst. You’re in a weird tight spot.”

Alise Cortez
Who wants to give that message? So, the phone rings and I’m hoping he doesn’t pick up. So, he picks up, and he goes, “Alise, guess what? I’m all the way up to conflicted fit,” which is like six modes up from existential crisis, and I let a deep breath go. And I’m like, “Well, what happened? What’s going on?” He goes, “Well, Alise, after you interviewed me, remember when you sent me the transcript about our interview,” which is part of my design, “I shared that with my wife and my mother-in law, and when they read it, they wept. They had no idea I was so miserable.”

“And so, immediately, what that did was it opened them, and they just began to support me in a whole different way that I’ve just never had with them before. And so, suddenly, I just felt understood and appreciated in a way that I just never had.” And he said, “Today, I have the same boss. I still work, he still screams, I still walk on eggshells, I have the same crappy hours.” But he said, “You know what I’ve come to understand is I make good money. I can send both my kids to college. My kids are proud of where I work.”

And so, the only thing that has changed, Pete, is his attitude, about how he’s come to understand his work. So, conflicted fit, that particular mode, what that speaks to is you’re in the right kind of work but you’re in the wrong place or the wrong environment. That’s what that particular mode describes. Existential crisis speaks to having a negative view of yourself because of the work that you’re doing, and you’re literally on such an existential level that it’s literally chopping away your soul. So, it was quite a change for him.

But, again, all that speaks to is getting conscious, getting aware of, “Where are you today? What can you do to start to turn and other people and where you want to be in life? And how can you change, literally, what happens and how you decide what that means?” and that’s your attitudinal change. So, he’s a great example of, literally, in a matter of some weeks, he could change his whole life and his health and his relationships, but for the way that he was relating to his work.

Pete Mockaitis
Wow, that’s cool. Six rungs without actually changing the work itself. That’s pretty potent. Now, I want to hear a little bit about, when it comes to if we are trying to inspire others, what should we think about?

Alise Cortez
Yeah, I love that question. That’s a killer question. Well, if we want to inspire others, first we need to get turned on ourselves. That is job number one. You got to be turned on in your own life. People do not want to follow somebody who is a dill pickle, who wants to hear about all the negative stuff that’s going on in the world. That’s not who they want to follow.

They want to follow somebody who’s excited about their own lives and feels great about where they’re going and what’s happening around them, and in the process, they’re looking to see what’s amazing and great about you, “Wow, I’ve never seen anybody problem-solve like you do in such a creative way.” And, usually, people are like, “What? Really?”

And so, when you, as a leader, can see what’s amazing and great about your people, and you help them then lift to a higher version of that by giving them opportunities, and challenging them in a loving way to get them to be able to become higher versions of themselves, to realize more of their potential, that is an inspirational leader that people want to follow. People want to be able to realize their best, and they can’t do it alone.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. So, that’s the starting point. And then what?

Alise Cortez
And then from there, you got to hold them to that. So, if you do it right, you’re going to bring them to places where they’re scared to death, “What do you mean, Pete, you want me to go and do that project? I can’t do that project. I’ve never done that before.” “Mm-hmm, I know. So, here’s how we’re going to help you get through that.” And if they aren’t literally, if their knees aren’t knocking on occasion, you’re not doing enough.

Now, some people don’t want to be challenged to that quite so you got to understand a little bit of their appetite before you go pushing them over the edge. So, that means you got to really become a fantastic listener. And so, the best leaders, literally, do transform lives, and you know you’ve done this well when you give them appreciation and feedback, and the appreciation that you give them, literally, can move them to tears and when they want to stay in touch with you for years over time. They don’t want to let you go, then you know you’ve done this well.

But it’s really about transforming their lives, helping them to be able to see a greater possibility given the resources, to be able to create that within and for themselves, and introduce them to possibilities and opportunities that they couldn’t have by themselves.

Pete Mockaitis
And, likewise, could you share a story of this coming to life?

Alise Cortez
I’m going to share my own. And this is a great example of an inspirational leader. I grew up in a small town north east of Oregon, I couldn’t get out of there fast enough. My ticket out was Roland Harvel, who owned a small pumping company that I got to do a co-op job for, and he said the magic words, “If you ever find yourself in Portland, you’ve got a job with me.” I’m like, “I got to go. I’ll see you later.” I graduate high school, get to Portland, do a little bit of business college, go to work for him for 18 months in his commercial real estate development company as his administrative assistant.

Pete, great job, time of my life. I’m in downtown Portland, I’m working for a commercial real estate developer, and just thinking, “He teaches me so much. He’s funny. He’s bigger than life. He pulls me forward. He believes in me,” all this sort of things. Eighteen months on the job, one day out to lunch, he passes by my front desk, opens the door, walks out, over his shoulder he says, “You got to get out here. You got to go see the world. Get an education. Do something with yourself. But before you go, hire your replacement,” and the door shuts.

So, I’m wondering the whole time he’s gone, just the singular question, “Did he just fire me?” So, he comes through that same door a little over an hour, just merrily walks through and goes back to his desk, and I stopped him, I’m like, “Hold on just a second, Roland. Did you just fire me?” And he said, “Absolutely. It’ll be a crime to keep you here.”

So, here’s the magical thing about this, Pete. Before he said what he said to me, I did not know I could go to college. My parents were farmers and restaurateurs. They were very successful entrepreneurs. We didn’t talk about college. So, a bachelor’s, three masters, and a PhD later, I think I can check the education box. He told me to go see the world.

I lived in Spain and Brazil. I learned those languages. I speak five different languages. I’ve done work in many parts of the world and travel all the time. Still working on that “What do you do with your life?” That will be a forever thing. But this guy, we’re still involved. He’s 84 years old now, and he came to my wedding. He called me every weekend when I got my divorce in 2016. Today, my job is to cheer for him as he brings together his new invention – the interlude chair. So, we’re still connected after all this time, so a really great leader.

He totally saved my life, Pete. God, I don’t know how long, I’d probably still be there if he hadn’t…he saw something in me that I couldn’t see in myself. He showed me that vision and he led me to it, and it required, in his case, to kick me out of the nest. But what a saving grace and what a gift, and I’ll never be able to thank him enough for that.

Pete Mockaitis
And I’m curious, when you say he saw something in you, you did not see in yourself, I mean that sounds…in some ways, it just sounds like, “Oh, he has a gift. How lovely.” Can we learn to do that? And how?

Alise Cortez
Yeah, I love that question, Pete. You’re so good at this. Yeah, we sure can. And I use this phrase “Go looking for your people. Go looking for them.” Pete, he saw things my parents couldn’t see in me. They couldn’t see with their eyes. I do think he’s unique because he’s a Czechoslovakian-American, he survived getting out of the war, he was headed toward the camps, so I do think there was something special about him, and we can all learn from him.

So, if we will literally stop looking at “What’s wrong with people? What are they not doing right?” which usually translates to “What aren’t they doing like I do because my way is right?” and we start looking for, “What’s right about these people? What’s different? What’s unique? Why is it that Sally always asks these razor-sharp questions in meetings that some people find to be kind of put-off but they’re so incisive? What can we do with that?”

Like, go looking for the gem in every one that we have in our group, in our team, and talk with them about, “Where is your life going? What do you want to do? Do you know that you have this amazing gift to be able to really understand and make explicit that which others can’t see? Do you know that? Most of the type of people don’t know that.”

So, when leaders can go looking for what’s really right and different and special about their people, and help them, one, become aware of that, and then, two, if they’re interested, steward that, develop that, learn to apply it, that’s an amazing gift. That’s an amazing gift to people.

Pete Mockaitis
Lovely. Well, tell me, Alise, anything else you want to make sure to mention before we shift gears and hear about some of your favorite things?

Alise Cortez
I guess I will always emphasize the point of we really do just have one precious life as far as we know. And, really, it’s an opportunity, it’s your responsibility to do what you want in that, and it takes energy to do that, and it’s right there. Logotherapy teaches us that being able to find the meaning in the moments is the easiest cheapest thing that you can do to be able to steward that journey in an energizing, invigorating, vitalizing way. And it’s right there for you.

Pete Mockaitis
All right. Well, now could you share with us a favorite

Pete Mockaitis
book?

Alise Cortez
It’s not a book but it’s a story. It’s called The Beast in the Jungle. Do you know it?

Pete Mockaitis
Mm-hmm.

Alise Cortez
I forget who the author is. I’m sure one of our listeners will remind us. I read it when I was in my late teens, and it was so powerful for me. This is the power of writing and the power of stories. But the essence of it, Pete, is that the author, the narrator is talking about this awful thing that’s going to happen to him in his life, and it he knows it and so he avoids all these relationships. And, also, that there’s something really, really special that’s waiting for him, too. There’s something awful and something special, and he spends his whole life protecting himself.

But he makes this friendship with this woman, and she totally buys into his vision of himself, and they become lifelong friends. At the end of this thing, we discover that their relationship was really, it’s hinted anyway, that their relationship is really was the beast in the jungle the whole time. It was the thing that he was afraid of and it was also his best gift. It just reminded me so much of how much we can lose in life when we’re not open to the experience of life unfolding, and that we don’t trust the magic of the moments that are right here in front of us all the time. So, it was such a profound book for me and it’s something I’ve never been able to forget.

Pete Mockaitis
And is there a key nugget you share that really seems to connect and resonate with folks; they quote it back to you often?

Alise Cortez
What people generally say about me is I’m energy and I’m inspiring. People remember the “What will you do with your one precious life?” People remember that “You have it within you to do what you want.” Those are some of the major takeaways that people get from what I speak.

Pete Mockaitis
And if folks want to learn more or get in touch, where would you point them?

Alise Cortez
My principal website is the easiest – AliseCortez.com. That’s the easiest.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay. And do you have a final challenge or call to action for folks looking to be awesome at their jobs?

Alise Cortez
Yeah, get really flipping clear about what you’re passionate about, and do that. Do that like to the hilt. That is your one opportunity to distinguish yourself, and, in so doing, you will totally energize and light yourself up.

Pete Mockaitis
All right. Alise, this has been a treat. I wish you much purpose and inspiration.

Alise Cortez
Thanks, Pete. I got more books to write, so thanks for the opportunity to be on the show with you. I appreciate getting to share my message.