285: Upgrading Your Promotion Potential with Terra Winston

Pete Mockaitis
Terra, hello and welcome to How To Be Awesome At Your Job.

Terra Winston
Hi, I’m so excited to be here.

Pete Mockaitis
Oh, thank you.  I’m excited to have you.  And I learned a little bit about you, and one thing is that you have a passion for Doctor Who.  Tell us about this.

Terra Winston
Oh Pete, I do, I really do.  And I have to say this is what happens when you don’t have good cable coverage.

Pete Mockaitis
You’ve got to go to the UK.

Terra Winston
You end up following monsters.  Actually there was a point in time when all the cable companies switched over to digital.  And so I had a TV in my bedroom that didn’t have a cable box, and I was like, “Am I going to pay money for my bedroom?  No, I’m not.”  And what that relegated me to was 13 beautiful channels, just 13.  So I found myself at times at night, “No, I don’t want the news.  No, I don’t want the infomercial.  Hey, what is this?”
And there I found this crazy British show with some of the worst special effects I’ve ever seen.  But, it wasn’t the news or an infomercial.  And so, I started watching it in the background and I fell in love with it.  And I think what still connects me – and I know there are tons of people just like me come out the shadows and admit it, that are Doctor Who fans – is the promise of exploring all of space and time.  And as a learner, that to me is all the possibilities.  Why wouldn’t I want to follow that?

Pete Mockaitis
Well, it does sound like fun.  And I’ve never actually seen the show.  In prepping for this interview, I just was pulling up Wikipedia and YouTube.  It was like, “Okay, I know Doctor Who is a show.  UK, sci-fi.”  But I’ve heard of it many, many, many times, but never actually seen it.  And so, I understand the latest – this is no spoiler, this is in the news – the latest regeneration of Doctor Who for the first time is a woman.

Terra Winston
It’s a huge deal in the Who-verse. But it’s, like I said, all the possibilities.  How wonderful is that, that you can have a legacy character and it can grow with the times?  Quite frankly, if we looked at some of our other long-standing television shows, you kind of wish they would evolve, right?

Pete Mockaitis
James Bond will be a woman next time.  Janette Bond.

Terra Winston
Yeah, Janette Bond.  But yeah, you don’t want to know where she hides the gun.

Pete Mockaitis
Alright, well, I think we’re warmed up.  Thank you.  So tell us, what’s your company, inTerractions, all about?  Which is a very clever name – you have the capital T for the Terra in the middle of inTerractions.  What’s the story here?
Terra Winston

First of all, the name is one that people are always wondering.  I will tell you this is what happens when you try to buy an URL, and everything is taken.  Even crazy words like “Google” are taken.  You have to start resorting to slamming your name in the middle of words, just to see what works.  But inTerractions for me is a place that helps good people do great things.  And so, I get to work with individuals and entrepreneurs and leaders and even whole teams, and help knock down all the barriers that keep them from fulfilling their highest potential.  And so whether I’m doing coaching or whether my team is doing training, or even facilitation or consulting, we’re really about problem-solving, and get all that mess out of the way so that you can be your best.

Pete Mockaitis
That’s good.  And so, in learning about you something that really resonated for me as a potential fit between what you know and what my listeners want to know, is, you do some real work with professionals about getting promoted, and how that is done.  And so, I’d love to get your take here.  You’ve talked to a lot of people in a lot of environments and backgrounds, and you’ve had the fortune of going deep with that – Coaches CTI Training, oh yeah.  So, tell us – how should we start thinking about it?  If folks are looking to get promoted, what’s sort of your main philosophy or orienting principles to start the journey?

Terra Winston
So now, Pete, I have to warn you – I’m from Jersey originally, and what that means is I’m very practical.  And that’s how I dig into my work as a coach.  And I think back to my time in HR, my time as a coach, and all the various Industries and leaders I’ve worked with, and I will tell you this – I repeat the same advice for anyone who wants to get promoted.
Number one – understand who promotes you, and then number two – understand what they value.  And often times people get that mixed up.  So, it is very rare in an organization that only your manager has a responsibility and the ability to promote you by themselves.  It usually requires enrolling people.  Chances are there’s a conference room full of folks – probably your bosses, peers, and the manager above that, probably HR, and there may even be some other hangers-on that all kind of get in this conversation and have to vet whether or not someone can be promoted.  And if you’re not aware of that, it’s very easy to think that you’re killing it, in terms of your work, but not realizing that there are other factors at play.

Pete Mockaitis
Oh Terra, I love that so much.  This reminds me when I was an intern at Bain and I was all about getting that job offer, and I had a sort of like an “a-ha” moment, in which I assumed that the manager was the person who made the decision – that’s what I was told.  And so, I was working closely with this guy – Kyle – who was awesome, and his title was Senior Associate Consultant.  And so we were doing the day-to-day work, but Kyle was so cool and friendly, and I just thought we were like buds.  And so then he was talking about, “Hey, they’ve made some mistakes here, we’ve got to really sharpen some things up for the offer.”  And I said, “Oh, isn’t it the manager who makes the offer?”  And he’s like, “Well yeah, but I have the primary input into that decision because I’m kind of day-to-day working with you and seeing what you can do.”  And I said, “Oh wait, I’m supposed to be dazzling you?” [laugh] “I thought we were just buds, Kyle.”  And he was like, “Well, yes, I would like to be dazzled.”  And it was like, “Okay, thank you.  This was helpful.”

Terra Winston
It’s so true, and it’s not always easy.  And I will tell you, I have actually coached people who have been in organizations for 10-15 years, and the landscape can change.  And so the people who were involved in promoting you five years ago – the organization may have reworked, the power structure could have changed, just in terms of politics.  And all of a sudden you find out the people that were involved in your
promotion before aren’t as involved anymore.  So you’ve got to stay on top of that.

Pete Mockaitis
And I’m intrigued, to what extent is… Because you’ve worked with many different organizations.  To what extent is this kind of quiet and shrouded in mystery – the Council of Elders who make the determination, versus it’s very much clearly out in the open?  Or how do you gather that information?  Is it as easy as saying, “Hey, who all makes the decision?”  Or how do you get it?

Terra Winston
You’d actually be surprised.  Most of it is actually pretty open, but we just don’t think about it.  So, for bigger companies – I say mid-size and bigger companies that have the annual career planning, management planning process – they usually start at some point with you being given goals and objectives, a junior manager sits down with, and then there is a point in the mid-year when you talk about your career and how you’re doing against your goals.  And at the end of the year they’ll get your review, and that will then lead to next year, and usually maybe some money involved.
Now, what’s going along with that that’s often called the performance management process – there’s a backend to that.  So when your manager takes back your objectives or your ratings, they go into a meeting with, usually their peers, or some subset of their peers, and they are talking about you versus someone else on another team.  That process is usually very clearly outlined.  And if you were to ask your manager, “Well, how do you guys come to the ratings?” or, “What’s the process where you guys determine who gets promoted?” – they can very clearly tell you.  We just don’t ask.
And it usually isn’t something that involves you to be involved in, and so they don’t think to tell you.  So at least get the primary players.  Now all the influencers, some of that – it’s a matter of asking some people who may have been there.  That’s where mentors and sponsors come in great in an organization, but you should be able to very clearly figure out who the group is.  Now, for those of us who work in smaller organizations, it may be a single line.  It could very well be your manager and then the owner of the business.  Or if your manager is the owner of the business – ta-da!  You know exactly who makes all the decisions.  But you should be able to ask and get 90% of the way there.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay, that’s good, thank you.  Alright, and so then when you talked about the goals, I want to get your take on. How often are the stated goals the real goals, versus, should you push harder and get after something that actually matters more to your boss, and your boss’s boss, and the organization at large?

Terra Winston
Okay, I love this question, because remember, I said there were two pieces.  It was knowing who promotes you and knowing what they value.  And so the goals that you have are very similar to your job description, and they list what your role should be.  Now that doesn’t tell you anything necessarily about what it takes to get ahead.  What that tells you is what your minimum expectations are.  And we tend to get that a little bit twisted.
When it comes to the realities, your manager and everyone that promotes you – they’re humans, with all the beautifulness and the flaws of being human.  So there will be some things that may be on your plate that are more interesting to them, because it makes them look good, or it may be something they’re more concerned about, or maybe they just happen to love that area.  So, there will be things that are on your plate that they go, “Ooh!”, and there will be things that are on your plate that they go, “Okay.”

Pete Mockaitis
Yeah.  And the side effects really help actually.  I like that.

Terra Winston
So in my very scientific way.

Pete Mockaitis
Well, because I think you’re right – some of them go, “Ooh”, because it’s like, “Ooh, there’s a lot of dollars associated with this and that’s very exciting.”  And other times it’s not even rational like that; it’s like, “Yeah, that is a dumb process that we’ve had for a long time, and I hate it.  And oh, you’re going to go fix it once and for all – ooh, that is exciting to me.  I value that and it gets me going, even if maybe the size of the prize in dollar terms might not be that huge.”

Terra Winston
Exactly.  And I’ve coached people who have lost promotions to peers who didn’t stack up the same amount of numbers, that didn’t deliver on all the objectives in the same way, and then it feels very hurtful.  But what they did do were things that were either visible or highly valued to the people who make the decisions.  And that’s not fair, but that’s reality – so getting a sense for kind of what those things are.
And I’ll tell you the other piece – goals can also be very misleading.  I can’t even tell you the number of times I’ve been brought in, where the leadership in the organization says, “This person is not ready to be promoted.  They have everything that they need but they’re still not ready.”  And when I ask what is that thing holding them back, it may be something like executive presence.  Do they have the gravitas, do they have the temperament, are they showing up as a leader?  Nothing to do with their work.  And then I go and I meet with the individual and I say, “Why do you think you haven’t been promoted?”  And the person says, “I’m not working hard enough.  I just need to deliver on these goals.”

Pete Mockaitis
Powerful disconnect.

Terra Winston
Powerful disconnect.  And it’s so easy to run yourself into a corner and then be really disillusioned.  That’s how good people get lost.  And so, paying attention to the goals is great.  Understanding what people value, and that is what they value in terms of the task and what they value in terms of the relationship and the being of a leader.

Pete Mockaitis
Yes, that’s great.  And so, when it comes to getting a sense for what they value, I think one action step is just to observe – where are their “Oohs” versus “Uhhs”, and really seem engaged and asking follow-up questions and their eyes are getting brighter?  So, what are some other pro tips for gathering this intelligence on what the folks value?

Terra Winston
So people will always ask about a lot; the things that matter to them.  So, when you get to a one-on-one or when you happen to be talking those infamous elevator conversations and you’re kind of bumping into people and they say, “Hey, how’s that so-and-so project going?” – that tells you that that’s something that’s big enough on their mind.  They didn’t ask you how that report B1716C paperwork was going.  So, they will tell you with attention.
Also pay attention to town halls or announcements.  What are the types of projects or programs or initiatives that get the big billing, and then kind of where does that trickle down to your work?  In those places you can tell that those are important initiatives to people.
And last resort is, sit down and talk to your manager or talk to someone else and say, “I’m working on all these things.  What do you think is the most exciting piece?”  Now, what you’re not asking is, “Where should I put my energy?”  Because they’re going to tell you, “Everything”, because that is the responsible thing to say.  But, “Tell me, of all the work that I’m working on, what do you think is the most exciting for the company?”  Or, “Give me your opinion.”  Their opinions will let you get a glimpse into the things that turn them on.  You can hear it in their voice at that point.

Pete Mockaitis
Alright, that’s good.  Okay.  Well, maybe could you give us a story or an example that can make some of this stuff come to life here?

Terra Winston
Absolutely.  So actually I want to continue the story about the poor guy who thought he had to work harder to get his promotion.  And it was interesting because as a coach I can’t come in and say, “I’ve spoken to everyone and they say that your work is great, but you just don’t seem like a leader.”  And I will tell you the frustration that I had is they absolutely said to me, “He just doesn’t seem like it, and we can’t articulate why.”
And I come to this poor person and I had to observe him and get a sense for how he showed up in the room.  And I will tell you the little things that we did – and I think this is the important piece of it – remember, it was about presence.  The piece that was so critical is, he just needed to show up with more power.  And so, the things that we worked on, Pete, believe it or not, was where he sat in the room, to the pacing, we looked at the way that he was dressed and the way that he delegated to people while in the room, because he was a servant-leader, he was someone who was so gracious, he was the exact kind of person that you want to be a leader, not one of these blowhard people.  But he was getting exiled because people couldn’t see how great he was.  He didn’t always deliver in his confidence.
But understanding number one, what is the culture of success?  So there’s a success profile in every organization – good, bad or indifferent.  When you look at the types of people that get the best opportunities, the people that get promoted, that move up fast – you will start to look and see patterns.  And so, where those patterns are will give you a sense for the types of attributes, leadership attributes that are valued for a success profile.  And you start to look at where are their gaps.
So, “These people always seem to be very extroverted; I tend to be very introverted.”  Now the answer is not then to change who you are.  But the answer’s to figure out how to use your strengths to deliver the same general feel.  So for this guy, who tended to be a bit introverted, and like I said, the nicest of people, to show power… There’s one version of power that bangs on the table, but we worked on showing power by granting power to others.  And so, understanding that part of how he was showing up and how it then related to how he got his goals done, we were able to get him over this hump.

Pete Mockaitis
Yeah, that’s intriguing, when you talk about the profiles of power and the patterns that show up.  I once was doing some Myers-Briggs coaching 101 for all of these rising executives at an international beverage company.  We’ll not say any names.  And it was fascinating how time and time again it was like extroversion, extroversion, extroversion was popping up.  And sometimes as part of the coaching, trying to help them see the value of different preferences and all that, I was like, “So can you think of some folks that you work with who prefer introversion?”  And some of them were like, “No.” [laugh] I was like, “Really?  This isn’t going how I expected.”  But it was startling.
Then when I did talk to a couple of those who preferred introversion, it was almost like they were in the closet.  It was like, “Oh yeah, what I really like is just to be able to think about things for a while.”  It’s so exhausting being around these folks.  And so, I think that’s interesting to highlight that explicitly.  And you said good, bad, indifferent, and I like that because at times I think you’ll notice that you may not just resonate with that.  I think I’ve seen in some organizations it’s like, “Wait a minute.  This rock star – I notice time and time again this person seems to be doing all this extra work that doesn’t really seem urgent or essential, but she just busts it out time after time after time.  And oh, there she is, getting an earlier promotion.”  It’s like, “Oh, so I guess we love that around here.”  It sort of opens your eyes there.

Terra Winston
It absolutely does, and that’s why knowing who promotes you starts to play into this.  So say I am one of those introverts in that extrovert international beverage company that you talked about.  And I feel like I need to be heard but people can’t hear me in big groups.  I may schedule one-on-ones with some of the people that are in the promotion room.  Now you don’t schedule meetings to say, “I want to talk to you so that you can say something nice about me when it comes time for promotion”, but you start to build those relationships.  You casually drop in some of the work that you’ve been doing that they may not hear about because your voice just isn’t as loud as everyone else’s.  When they get into the room they will then be able to access that.  So you play them together.

Pete Mockaitis
And so I’d love to get your take here, in terms of, this is an issue that comes up with listeners frequently – they’ll say they get feedback that they are great, they’re doing great work, they’re a top performer and all this stuff, they’re very impressive in these ways, but “Oh, unfortunately there are just no advancement opportunities available.”  So, I’d love you take, Terra, on when you hear that message, what are your options?

Terra Winston
Right.  So first, you’re totally allowed to go home and grab a drink and be really mad.  That is by far…  I grant you permission to feel that way, because I think one of the dirty little secrets about organizations is that they actually don’t exist solely to help you manage your career.  They actually are doing their business.  And so, it really is this lovely combination of, are you ready, and is there an opportunity that the company needs?  And so it can be really frustrating when those two things don’t line up.  So number one – I don’t want you to have despair.  That’s not about you.  I think sometimes we take that as a hit to ourselves.
But after you do that, whilst you’re waiting for a position to open, know that you own your career, so if you can’t get promoted in the company, you should be promoting yourself in your own role.  And this is what I mean: So a promotion is someone giving you a bigger scope, a bigger impact, bigger responsibility or a new experience.  That technically is what a promotion is.  I know we all tend to think of the extra money that comes with it, and the title.  But really, a promotion is about increasing your impact in some kind of way.  So you do that.  So talk to your manager.  Think about, “Okay, I’m working on this one project and it impacts our region.  What can I do that maybe will cross several regions, or multiple functions?  What type of additional work can I do?  Can I look at my manager’s plate and offer to take something off of that, so that I can grow my expertise?”
So you should be increasing your scope.  So basically you’re going to give yourself your own promotion.  By doing that when something else comes up – and it always will, because business changes so fast – you will have demonstrated skills, impact at the next level.  Sometimes that gap is what people believe we can do, versus what they’ve seen us do.  So you’ve already demonstrated that and made it very visible.  And by the way, even if you decide not to stay in the organization, you can then use that extra experience to parlay yourself into a promotion somewhere else.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay, that’s good.  And so, I’d like to think a little bit here, do you have any pro tips sort of in the bite-sized department?  Any tips, tools, tactics, favorite scripts or key phrases, sentences you love to say or suggest to folks when they’re playing this game?

Terra Winston
So I’ve got two.  One you can use immediately and one that may take you a little bit longer.  So the first one, the quick one: “Likability is the killer app.”  It always, always is the killer app.  So we tend to work with people that we like.  We give people extra chances if we like them.  If we’ve built some type of connection, if you make a mistake I’m more likely to give you some grace for it.  I’m more likely to see your potential if I think that you’re someone that’s likable.
And what happens – we have all these wonderfully nice people when we work with them as peers, but they go into a meeting with someone who maybe has some influence, and they’re so focused on proving their credibility that they let nerves erode the personality that they have.

Pete Mockaitis
Alright, yeah.

Terra Winston
So, I work with executives and I have some executives that will call me before they go into major meetings, and we’ll just run through kind of what they need to cover.  And number one is usually, “They called you into this meeting because they know how good you are.  You just need to make them like you.”  And so, what I tend to tell anyone going into networking at all is, number one – you want them to like you, number two – you want them to think you’re smart, number three – maybe you want to stay connected.  Nothing else matters.  You don’t have to convince them to marry you on the first date, right?  So, likability is the thing that you can start today.  Let your personality shine through, let people see how great you are, and make that connection and it will take you so much further.

Pete Mockaitis
Alright, thank you.

Terra Winston
So the longer term one is actually some of the best career advice I’ve ever gotten.  I can’t take credit for it, because someone gave it to me.  And what he said to me was, “It’s always easy to stand out when you have a job or a role that does not have many peers.”  So if you think about in a typical company maybe there’s an army of accountants, or there’s HR people in every region, and all those things.
When you do really well, you have to do exceptionally well to stand out from the crowd, because everyone’s doing well.  Or you may stand out because you had a particularly bad year.  But when there’s lots of comparison points it’s really hard to stand out.  But if you’re willing to take a risk and take a role that maybe does not have as many peers… So, “I was an accountant but I’m going to work on this new turnaround.”  So it just feels different, then they don’t have as many people to compare it to.  So every victory looks like a bigger victory.

Pete Mockaitis
I love that.  And right now I’m thinking because I’m creating this course and I’m working with designers.  I’m thinking about how easily impressed I am by the output of designers, just because I’m so terrible at drawing.  I think I know what’s good when I see it, kind of, but in terms of actually if I get into Photoshop I shouldn’t be trusted with much, just like basically rearranging things symmetrically is about what you can trust me with there.
So, I’m depending on these designers and I’m just so impressed, like, “Wow!”  And I know for them it’s like, “Yeah, that took me 10 minutes.”  And so, I love that notion because, sure enough, it you are the designer amongst the accountants, or the turnaround specialist, or the keynote speaker, the coach or whatever, sort of being distinctly different from those – they are readily impressed.  And so that’s good to chew on for a little while there.

Terra Winston
It’s so good.  I wish I got there earlier in my career, but I’d now pass it on to all of you.

Pete Mockaitis
Yeah.  And at the same time, it does feel like a greater risk because I have fewer role models or potential mentors who can show me what I’m doing right or wrong, or to model from.  So that’s kind of nice – it’s like higher risk, higher reward.  But if you have some other prudent approaches to fill any potential knowledge gaps you have, then you kind of have the best of both worlds.

Terra Winston
Absolutely.  And remember, everyone that’s listening to us has a high potential.  So I guess it’s the opposite advice – if you want to sit in the middle of the pack and not have anybody make too many waves, then choose a role that has lots of peers.  It works both ways, and you get to choose the kind of life that you want.  But there is no high chance of promotion without a risk of failure.  And I will tell you that failure by itself will not stop your career.  It’s so much more about how you react, respond and recover from failure.  That is what gets you by, and if you have confidence not only in yourself willing to take the risk, but willing to know that whatever you trip up on, you can figure it out – that’s your cue to win.

Pete Mockaitis
That’s good.  Well, Terra, I’d also love to get your take, since you do that good coaching stuff, can you share what’s maybe some of the irrational stuff that we’ve got going on that can impede the promotions from happening, whether it’s lowering your beliefs, or risks not taken, or safety?  What do you see, in terms of high-performing folks, in terms of some sub-optimal stuff going on in their mind that is limiting?

Terra Winston
So confidence by far is the biggest one.  And I know we’re used to hearing that all the time, but what I see is people devalue those things that come easy to them.  And so, rather than saying, “Hey, this is a core strength of mine.  Let me use this and show up in my core strength”, we then discount: “Oh well, if I did that and it was so easy, it must not have been a big deal.”  And we don’t showcase it.  So we then spend all our time on some of the things that may not be our towering strengths, because we’re trying to overcome our weaknesses.  And so what you end up doing is discounting the places where you’re a superstar, amplifying the places where you might be average.  And that’s never been the key to promoting yourself.
I think another piece of it is we struggle with this balance between humility and arrogance and self-promotion.  We are now so busy in organizations that there is not one person, including your direct manager, who knows all of what you do.  And so if you don’t find a way to tell them, then it’s very easy for your great accomplishments to be drowned out by even mediocre accomplishments by someone else who’s out there screaming from the rooftops, “Look what I did, look what I did.”  And at times it can really feel like an internal distress.
When I worked at a large international beverage company myself, and I did work in diversity, I would work with some of the groups who would say, “Terra, culturally growing up from the time when I was young, I was told not to boast about myself.  We have a collective community focus.  You don’t stand out.  But then I come to Corporate America”, or Corporate Western Europe, or Corporate Anywhere at this point, “And you keep telling me that I’m supposed to stand up and put a spotlight on myself and scream about how great I am.  I can’t get over that voice in my gut – my grandmother’s voice that’s telling me that that’s the wrong thing to do.  So am I destined just to not get what I deserve?”  And answer is no.  You find your own way, and that’s again looking at your strengths.  If certain people need to know what you do, can you go in and teach a lunch-and-learn?  Can you mentor someone?  Can you find other ways to get your name out there, so that people know what you do?
So I can give you an example.  Believe it or not, I found myself in one of those Infamous elevator pitch moments.  There was someone who was my boss’s boss’s boss’s boss adjacent.  So someone very senior from me, and I was in the Human Resources team.  And there was a big movement going on around organization design.  And so now I find myself alone in an elevator with this person, and either I can shrink in the back and hopefully fade into the woodwork, or I can step up.
And what I said to this person… I happened to, when I was in a consulting firm, I’d worked on the organization design methodology.  And so I said to this very senior person, “Heard the town hall, glad we’re doing work in this area.  I actually did some work back when I was at a consulting firm.  If you ever want, I can get some of the information to your assistant, in case you need it.”  And so by being of service, the senior person, A) knew my name, B) knew I had a background in consulting and I’d done some design work and I was going to follow up with information.  So find ways to kind of bring some visibility to it.  And a lot of times high-potential people are very confident in that the good work will be noticed.  And unfortunately people are so busy they don’t always notice it.

Pete Mockaitis
Right, thank you.  Well, that’s powerful stuff.  Thank you.  Well, tell us – is there anything else you want to make sure to mention before we shift gears and hear about some of your favorite things?

Terra Winston
No, I think that’s it.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay, cool.  Well then, can you share with us a favorite quote, something you find inspiring?

Terra Winston
Okay, so I have a favorite quote but I feel like it’s everybody’s favorite quote.  And it’s the one from Marianne Williamson, the fact that “Our deepest fear is not that we’re inadequate.  Our deepest fear is that we’re powerful beyond measure.”  And it speaks to me because I used to be so introverted, and it is what governs the coaching work that I do.  It’s so often the thing that is the key to people’s absolute phenomenal success, is something hiding behind their fear.  And so, when we get to work together and we get to identify – again, it’s like a stone standing in the way of this raging river of potential.  And we can knock that fear aside.  I’ve seen people, I’ve seen businesses, I’ve seen teams flourish.

Pete Mockaitis
Awesome, thank you.  And how about a favorite study or experiment or a piece of research?

Terra Winston
There was a study that talks about the power of loose networks.  And so what it said was, if you want to create more opportunity in your life, it is not your closest friends and closest associates that will bring it; it actually is that next level, if you think of your network as concentric circles.
And the reason why is because your closest friends that you spend time with – they are everywhere where you are.  If there was something they heard about, they would’ve told you already.  Whereas the next level out of people, who are in other bubbles, as we now call it – they have an opportunity to see things and channel them to you.  So that had been a study that absolutely comes up again and again, until about two months ago.  I did some research; I was curious if it was still adequate, if anyone had updated that survey and the study.  And I found out that they had.
And that was true, kind of early Internet days, when the challenge was visibility to opportunity.  Now with the way that the Internet is, we actually have ways to see more and more of things that were probably hidden in pockets.  Now, I still stand by that the power of loose ties is still relevant, but what the newest studies have actually circulated is that we now live in a world where you can see everybody, but you don’t know who’s legit.  I can look at your LinkedIn profile, but how do I know who I can spend time, money and energy on?
And so now there’s a rising importance of the power of former coworkers, or people that not just are loose in your network, but they have personal experience of your work.  That is where the credibility factor lies, and now the issue isn’t as much information transparency; it’s credibility. So how are you leveraging those networks, I think is the next level, of what we need to do better.

Pete Mockaitis
Thank you.  How about a favorite book?

Terra Winston
Right now I am in love with The Power of Moments by Chip and Dan Heath.  The book talks about what is it that makes any given moment special.  And that could be a moment in customer service, that could be creating the best family vacation experience.  Why do certain things stand out in our minds, and other things kind of wash away with the sands of time?  And so, we now hear people say we live in an experience economy, where it’s not about the stuff, it’s about the things that you do.  And I think we’re on overload so much, those of us who learn how to create moments are going to be the winners.

Pete Mockaitis
Thank you.  And how about a favorite tool, something that helps you be awesome at your job?

Terra Winston
My tool is a person.

Pete Mockaitis
I won’t tell that person that you think he or she is a tool.

Terra Winston
That was the wrong way to put it.  She’s going to kill me because she’s going to listen to this.  I have the most amazing virtual assistant.  And I think the virtual assistant services is something that many budding entrepreneurs don’t necessarily get very early.  But having someone that has my back makes a big difference.  And so I want translate for those of you guys that are working in companies and maybe are like, “Well Terra, I don’t have an assistant necessarily for my team.”
But having someone that you can bounce ideas off of, someone that you can sit down and talk about what your priorities are, whoever that person is – my virtual assistant plays that role; she’s actually my chief of staff for my business.  And so I think everyone needs someone that they can be fully themselves and with their guard down, someone that will give them the kind of feedback, but that is not a risk of it being from maybe an evaluation prospective.  And having a right hand in that way is phenomenal, and anyone and everyone should have one.

Pete Mockaitis
Okay, thank you.  And how about a favorite habit, something that helps you flourish?

Terra Winston
So, “networking” is one of those words that I actually ban a bunch of my clients from saying, because it dredges up all these feelings for people who aren’t necessarily extroverts or who just don’t love networking.  So I’m a big believer in making authentic connections, and that can be with anybody.  And one of the things that I always do at the end of connecting with someone is I ask them what I can do to bring them closer to their dreams.  And it could be, what do you need in your regular life, it could be a career thing that you have, maybe you just need the perfect pound cake recipe.  Why not ask?

Pete Mockaitis
I need it, Terra.

Terra Winston
You need it so bad.  But we are terrible at asking for help.  And so often times, the number of times that what you voice is something that I have access to.  Now I may not, but how would you know if you don’t ask?  And so, rather than forcing someone to ask, I take it upon myself to ask them.

Pete Mockaitis
And let’s hear that question one more time.

Terra Winston
So, “How can I bring you closer to your dreams?”

Pete Mockaitis
I like that.  It sounds better than, “How can I make your dreams come true?”, because it’s like, “Are you hitting on me right now?”  But it’s still succinct – okay, I like that.  And it’s a little bit more… I think it inspires more imagination than, “How can I be helpful to you?”  So I like that.

Terra Winston
Exactly, because people always need help.

Pete Mockaitis
That’s good.  And sometimes it might just be like, “You know what?  I want to have grass in my backyard, and I don’t know who to help me.”  It’s like, “Oh, I know a guy.”  And sure enough, the networking is happening, relationships strengthen and build.

Terra Winston
Mm-hmm.

Pete Mockaitis
That’s good.  Okay, thank you.  And tell us, is there a particular nugget you share that tends to really connect, resonate with folks and gets quoted back to you?

Terra Winston
Yes.  So, there’s a bunch of them; some of them are not for G-rating.  You guys have to work with me as a coach and I’ll give you some of the ones… We have a good time, with me and my clients.  But no, one that actually is really fundamental for me is, “Stop living someone else’s life.”  It’s so easy to live your life based on a set of “Should’s”: “This is what I should have” or, “I’m supposed to be promoted.”  “Why?”  “Well, because that’s what you do next.”
Do you want that job?  Do you have other dreams? Is this job that you’re doing right now, does it exist solely for you to save money to start that business that you want to do, or to move halfway across the world and live life as a nomad?  Well, if that’s the case, then does a promotion get you any closer, or is it just speaking to something that you feel like you’re on auto-pilot for?  And the number of times when we stop and really ask ourselves, “Is this what I really want?” – the answer is, “No, but I don’t know what else I’m supposed to have.”  So stop living someone else’s life.  Live yours – you only have one.

Pete Mockaitis
Thank you.  And if folks want to learn more or get in touch, Terra, where would you point them?

Terra Winston
Please, I love connecting with new people.  I am at TerraWinston on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram, because I’m not that creative with my names.  So I just use my name everywhere I go.  Come to my website, inTerractions.com.  We post information, and get connected – I would love to find out how I can help you towards your dreams too.

Pete Mockaitis
And do you have a final challenge or call to action you’d issue to folks seeking to be awesome at their jobs?

Terra Winston
Absolutely.  So, for those of you in your jobs – if you do nothing else, nothing else today – go to your list of annual goals.  And I want you to identify the three – no more than three – that are the most valued by your manager.  Now remember, we talked about the ways that you can tell, but stop looking at everything on your to-do list as having equal value to the people around you.  So, go through, identify what are the top priorities, and then figure out how do you manage your discretionary energy in a way that gets you where you want to go.

Pete Mockaitis
Alright.  Terra, thank you so much for sharing this.  Excellent stuff.  Hopefully there will be many promotions birthed from this conversation.  And I wish you lots of luck in all you’re up to!

Terra Winston
Thank you, Pete, I absolutely had a blast.  This is a great podcast.